Alternative to Rail System Caravelle Seats

[GilbsT32]

Hi All

Has anybody done this or can anyone advise me whether this is possible or not!

Trying to source caravelle rails or an alternative is proving either difficult or expensive with quotes ranging between £4000-£6000. This is money I can do so much more with when it comes to kitting out my van.
The 2/3 seats that tend to sit behind the drivers seat, are they on a quick release system?...........if so is it possible to this with Single Caravelle seats? however what I would like to do is have two seats in the back, but able to remove should I need the space to move something.

thanks advance for any help provided

 

[dubber36]

To remove Caravelle seats, you pop off the plastic end caps and front sections of the rail covers, then slide the seats all the way forwards and lift them out. It takes minutes.

If you want single seats all the way at the back, just slide them along the rails to whatever position you want. A little know fact is that single seats can be mounted on the central slots as well.

 

[GilbsT32]

To remove Caravelle seats, you pop off the plastic end caps and front sections of the rail covers, then slide the seats all the way forwards and lift them out. It takes minutes.

If you want single seats all the way at the back, just slide them along the rails to whatever position you want. A little know fact is that single seats can be mounted on the central slots as well.

Hi dubber36

thanks for the reply, however my question was more aimed at is it possible to replace the runner system that the caravelle seats currently use to a quick release system?

 

[roadtripper]

Do you have a Caravelle already or a van? If you are looking to put quick release seats in to a van the Caravelle rail system is not really what you are looking for. Yes the seats do remove but the single ones take a good 20 minutes and the bench is an absolute mission that will take a jig or a couple of mates and some profanity. It's not something you'd do to pop down to IKEA (they will fold sort of flat to do that) it's something you'd do to reconfigure the rear for a good few weeks.

Your problem is that the rail system and seats are crash tested as one system.

Anyone producing an after market system would need to do the same. There is a market enough for seat swivels and bed systems but I doubt there is for the niche Caravelle rail system.

The price you are being quoted may well reflect the cost of that on a small volume alternative seat system or the increasing rarity of new rail systems now the Caravelle has been out of production for a while.

 

[GilbsT32]

Do you have a Caravelle already or a van? If you are looking to put quick release seats in to a van the Caravelle rail system is not really what you are looking for. Yes the seats do remove but the single ones take a good 20 minutes and the bench is an absolute mission that will take a jig or a couple of mates and some profanity. It's not something you'd do to pop down to IKEA (they will fold sort of flat to do that) it's something you'd do to reconfigure the rear for a good few weeks.

Your problem is that the rail system and seats are crash tested as one system.

Anyone producing an after market system would need to do the same. There is a market enough for seat swivels and bed systems but I doubt there is for the niche Caravelle rail system.

The price you are being quoted may well reflect the cost of that on a small volume alternative seat system or the increasing rarity of new rail systems now the Caravelle has been out of production for a while.

Do you have a Caravelle already or a van? If you are looking to put quick release seats in to a van the Caravelle rail system is not really what you are looking for. Yes the seats do remove but the single ones take a good 20 minutes and the bench is an absolute mission that will take a jig or a couple of mates and some profanity. It's not something you'd do to pop down to IKEA (they will fold sort of flat to do that) it's something you'd do to reconfigure the rear for a good few weeks.

Your problem is that the rail system and seats are crash tested as one system.

Anyone producing an after market system would need to do the same. There is a market enough for seat swivels and bed systems but I doubt there is for the niche Caravelle rail system.

The price you are being quoted may well reflect the cost of that on a small volume alternative seat system or the increasing rarity of new rail systems now the Caravelle has been out of production for a while.

Hi Roadtripper

I don’t have a caravelle, just a 17 ex RAC van that I am looking to use as a day/leisure van.
The problem I have is I don’t want a bench seat, take up too much room and bulky should i need to remove.
My plan was to have two captains seats in the front on swivel bases and then to replicate this in the back using caravelle seats as they have the seat belts already attached to them also on swivel bases. Then i was thinking of having some sort of floor mounting for a table that could be removed along with the seats should i need to move something.
On the rear of the van I was hoping to have some sort of removable pod system with just a fridge and camping stove and some storage for disposable plates etc as not interested in a sink.
I wasn’t sure if someone had done this before or similar hence me asking what may be silly questions.
I recently saw this on the internet 2nd/3rd pics that seem to show Caravelle seats using a different rail system and thought if that could be done then is there a quick release system option also?

 

[roadtripper]

Not a silly question at all. The pictures make it much clearer.

You might get more answers from a thread titled Quick Release Rear Seats, Alternative Rail Systems For Caravelle Seats, Can Anyone Identify This Rail System, or similar as that seems to be your main question. With the current title you're likely to only get responses from Caravelle owners. You should be able to edit it.

I've done some similar things with our Caravelle with a kitchen pod across the back but we run the full set of seats. The kitchen pods is held down with a couple of clamps from Stee Free that use the rails.

You can get close to what you want if you were able to source the rails, 2 seats and the table unit using OEM parts. The bench is the biggest hassle and not really what I'd call removable but the smaller units can be. If it's for occasional conversion from one to the other for holidays you'll be fine, if it's every weekend to swap from work van to family van I think you'd soon tire of it and the front removable bits of the rails would get worn.

The big issue is going to be crash rating for legality, insurance and your own peace of mind. The mounting of the OEM rails is quite involved to ensure they are essentially part of the chassis, some of the aftermarket rear bed/seat rails only have a single position you can use when travelling and those that offer multiple are a smaller number of fixed positions and generally need the rail bonding direct to the chassis.

From the pictures that looks like a conversion to carry a wheelchair given the reels attached to the middle rails, so it might be worth trying to contact some of those specialists?

 

[GilbsT32]

Not a silly question at all. The pictures make it much clearer.

You might get more answers from a thread titled Quick Release Rear Seats, Alternative Rail Systems For Caravelle Seats, Can Anyone Identify This Rail System, or similar as that seems to be your main question. With the current title you're likely to only get responses from Caravelle owners. You should be able to edit it.

I've done some similar things with our Caravelle with a kitchen pod across the back but we run the full set of seats. The kitchen pods is held down with a couple of clamps from Stee Free that use the rails.

You can get close to what you want if you were able to source the rails, 2 seats and the table unit using OEM parts. The bench is the biggest hassle and not really what I'd call removable but the smaller units can be. If it's for occasional conversion from one to the other for holidays you'll be fine, if it's every weekend to swap from work van to family van I think you'd soon tire of it and the front removable bits of the rails would get worn.

The big issue is going to be crash rating for legality, insurance and your own peace of mind. The mounting of the OEM rails is quite involved to ensure they are essentially part of the chassis, some of the aftermarket rear bed/seat rails only have a single position you can use when travelling and those that offer multiple are a smaller number of fixed positions and generally need the rail bonding direct to the chassis.

From the pictures that looks like a conversion to carry a wheelchair given the reels attached to the middle rails, so it might be worth trying to contact some of those specialists?

Appreciate you taking the time to reply, I have taken your advise and changed the name of the thread…
I have found a pic online of a system called UNWIN(pic 1)and it looks very similar to the pics of the mobility pics.
I did even contact the seller of that van and asked if they would provide me with some pics of the seat mechanism……nope!…cheeky I know but if you dont ask…
I wasnt sure if the OEM seat

Not a silly question at all. The pictures make it much clearer.

You might get more answers from a thread titled Quick Release Rear Seats, Alternative Rail Systems For Caravelle Seats, Can Anyone Identify This Rail System, or similar as that seems to be your main question. With the current title you're likely to only get responses from Caravelle owners. You should be able to edit it.

I've done some similar things with our Caravelle with a kitchen pod across the back but we run the full set of seats. The kitchen pods is held down with a couple of clamps from Stee Free that use the rails.

You can get close to what you want if you were able to source the rails, 2 seats and the table unit using OEM parts. The bench is the biggest hassle and not really what I'd call removable but the smaller units can be. If it's for occasional conversion from one to the other for holidays you'll be fine, if it's every weekend to swap from work van to family van I think you'd soon tire of it and the front removable bits of the rails would get worn.

The big issue is going to be crash rating for legality, insurance and your own peace of mind. The mounting of the OEM rails is quite involved to ensure they are essentially part of the chassis, some of the aftermarket rear bed/seat rails only have a single position you can use when travelling and those that offer multiple are a smaller number of fixed positions and generally need the rail bonding direct to the chassis.

From the pictures that looks like a conversion to carry a wheelchair given the reels attached to the middle rails, so it might be worth trying to contact some of those specialists?

Appreciate you taking the time to reply, I have taken your advise and changed the thread name …….I have attached two pics below the 1st is off a system called UNWIN to which looks very similar to the alternative in the previous pics.
The 2nd pic is off the brackets a 2+1 fixed seat system would used. I wasn’t sure if this was also capable of being used as a quick release system being an OEM part!!
As for the van, it sits all week on the driveway as I have a works vehicle I use….its pretty much once converted going to be a day:leisure van, the sits will stay in there until if or when comes a time I need to pick/move something.

 

[roadtripper]

I'd agree they look very much like the unwin rail system. I think @TallPaul_S is using it to mount bikes in his conversion and may know some more.

The floor brackets you've posted are for mounting seats in fixed positions in things like the Kombi van.

I think with your use you could probably use the Caravelle system, just don't bother finding a bench. You'd need to find some rails and get them properly fitted though.

I've been very happy with my kitchen pod from Evo Design, there are others out there.

You can then get these profiles to put on the bottom of a pod which fit the top of the rail profile and help protect it:

Pardon our interruption...

Then you can use these T bolts and wheels through the middle of the profiles, they drop into the rail, you turn them 90 degrees (there is a handy slot in the top to show alignment and you can brace with a screwdriver) and tighten down clamping the unit and profile on to the rails:

Pardon our interruption...

I only needed two of each to stop my pod tipping when all the drawers were out as it's very wedged in so just dropped them a line and they did me a custom listing.

 

[TallPaul_S]

Yeah that's Koller Unwin rail, I'm using mine to mount bike fork mounts but it's M1 certified for use as seat mounting points with the right fixings.

Surface Rail | Koller Engineering

Koller Surface Rail allows a safe and simple way to change a vehicle seating/wheelchair layout when it is not possible or economical to fit other types of rail or floor systems

www.koller.co.uk

Low Profile Rail

Recessed into the vehicle floor, Koller Low Profile Rail is the safe and simple way to change a vehicle's seating/wheelchair layout, while also providing a professional, unobtrusive finish.

www.koller.co.uk

I bought my bits from here

https://ajw-veh-fittings.co.uk/product-category/track-fittings/

 

[GilbsT32]

I'd agree they look very much like the unwin rail system. I think @TallPaul_S is using it to mount bikes in his conversion and may know some more.

The floor brackets you've posted are for mounting seats in fixed positions in things like the Kombi van.

I think with your use you could probably use the Caravelle system, just don't bother finding a bench. You'd need to find some rails and get them properly fitted though.

I've been very happy with my kitchen pod from Evo Design, there are others out there.

You can then get these profiles to put on the bottom of a pod which fit the top of the rail profile and help protect it:

Pardon our interruption...

Then you can use these T bolts and wheels through the middle of the profiles, they drop into the rail, you turn them 90 degrees (there is a handy slot in the top to show alignment and you can brace with a screwdriver) and tighten down clamping the unit and profile on to the rails:

Pardon our interruption...

I only needed two of each to stop my pod tipping when all the drawers were out as it's very wedged in so just dropped them a line and they did me a custom listing.

I have seen several picture's on google that have used a similar system, so that is an option. I have since spoken to a colleague at work and he has recommended a guy that has in the past used transit custom short rails as they have a quick release system, also very similar to the Caravelle seat with arm rests etc. I am due to speak him next week and hopefully get to look at a conversion he has recently completed, could be promising and the answer to my probs. Thanks for the info re the eco design, I will take a look and decide what I really want on the back.

 

[ChrisBell]

I have seen several picture's on google that have used a similar system, so that is an option. I have since spoken to a colleague at work and he has recommended a guy that has in the past used transit custom short rails as they have a quick release system, also very similar to the Caravelle seat with arm rests etc. I am due to speak him next week and hopefully get to look at a conversion he has recently completed, could be promising and the answer to my probs. Thanks for the info re the eco design, I will take a look and decide what I really want on the back.

 

[ChrisBell]

I can vouch for the transit custom rails. If getting middle row seats from a tourneo custom (likely mobility conversion) the two outside single seats will have armrests typically. Rear seats won't. The central rails also allow seats to be positioned 6inch forward or back... Fold flat as well and hop up depending on space needed. I got my 3 including rails for circa 500 but know price has rocketed as well recently!

 

[GilbsT32]

I can vouch for the transit custom rails. If getting middle row seats from a tourneo custom (likely mobility conversion) the two outside single seats will have armrests typically. Rear seats won't. The central rails also allow seats to be positioned 6inch forward or back... Fold flat as well and hop up depending on space needed. I got my 3 including rails for circa 500 but know price has rocketed as well recently!

Hi Chris

Can I ask do you have any pictures? I am now looking to do the same ideally with the rails. Am I correct in thinking with the rails this allows the seat to be moved either back or forward?

 

[ChrisBell]

Hi Chris

Can I ask do you have any pictures? I am now looking to do the same ideally with the rails. Am I correct in thinking with the rails this allows the seat to be moved either back or forward?

Hi @GilbsT32 I can try get some pics tomorrow. Rails will allow repositioning of approx 150mm from memory. They don't slide but click in. With kids seats etc ours are in the front position I think. In a transit custom 3 seats fit across no bother. I believe from my converter it is a bit tighter in a transporter, vivaro or Renault etc. Seats are very good and comfy. I like how all individual seats have belts etc.
Mine were £500. Like everything price has rocketed. This is what I have....

Seat Ford Transit Custom Tourneo bench rear folding seats 3x single seat

for 2nd row of seats without floor brackets (we have also, please ask!)

foteledobusow.sklep.pl

 

[GilbsT32]

Hi @GilbsT32 I can try get some pics tomorrow. Rails will allow repositioning of approx 150mm from memory. They don't slide but click in. With kids seats etc ours are in the front position I think. In a transit custom 3 seats fit across no bother. I believe from my converter it is a bit tighter in a transporter, vivaro or Renault etc. Seats are very good and comfy. I like how all individual seats have belts etc.
Mine were £500. Like everything price has rocketed. This is what I have....

Seat Ford Transit Custom Tourneo bench rear folding seats 3x single seat

for 2nd row of seats without floor brackets (we have also, please ask!)

foteledobusow.sklep.pl

Hi Chris

They are good looking seats....What I would like to do is to have 3 sets of rails(if possible) yet 2 seats, that way I can move the seats between the rails or better still just unclip one and remove it should I need the extra room. Are you able to flip the seat around so you can look out the back of the van? The seats themselves, is there much difference in fittings from 2012-2022?..........I have seen seats go between £350 -£900 per seat

 

[Jonbee]

Yeah that's Koller Unwin rail, I'm using mine to mount bike fork mounts but it's M1 certified for use as seat mounting points with the right fixings.

Surface Rail | Koller Engineering

Koller Surface Rail allows a safe and simple way to change a vehicle seating/wheelchair layout when it is not possible or economical to fit other types of rail or floor systems

www.koller.co.uk

Low Profile Rail

Recessed into the vehicle floor, Koller Low Profile Rail is the safe and simple way to change a vehicle's seating/wheelchair layout, while also providing a professional, unobtrusive finish.

www.koller.co.uk

I bought my bits from here

https://ajw-veh-fittings.co.uk/product-category/track-fittings/

@TallPaul_S - thanks very much for this info , I'm considering converting my floor to accept (very occasional ) seats , van is a daily driver /motor bike carrier/ bare camper for most of its intended life.
Couple of questions , if you don't mind;

Did you do it yourself ? If so did you use the low profile rail & sink it into ply (or whatever you used ) , have you any photographs please ?

Thanks

John