LPG TSi - MPG

Shaun Witts

Shaun Witts

Ski Bus
VIP Member
T6 Guru
Just collected my van from being converted to LPG and thought I should post some photos:
The LPG fill nozzle is fitted where the Addblue one is on diesels.
1D884D61-D5D3-4374-83F0-3DD8FFC56701

1D884D61-D5D3-4374-83F0-3DD8FFC56701

Filler
The 84 litre tank replaces the spare wheel.
F86E33D2-094E-470B-ABAB-8F48A81C27EB

F86E33D2-094E-470B-ABAB-8F48A81C27EB

Tank from left
DDDC6C4D-D388-4978-9686-AF608CE9B697

DDDC6C4D-D388-4978-9686-AF608CE9B697

Tank from right.
There is an ECU mounted beside the battery
22F265B7-0D34-403A-A999-A24B77D63BCB

22F265B7-0D34-403A-A999-A24B77D63BCB

ECU
These are the LPG injectors.
B0AE1F0D-2783-49F0-8EF7-7CD47AE35E34

B0AE1F0D-2783-49F0-8EF7-7CD47AE35E34

Injectors
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8BE29369-3FBD-4F2D-ABB5-2C26AA52AC0C

Injectors left side
E2D1031F-CA5E-4D5D-9F40-641D38DACB86

E2D1031F-CA5E-4D5D-9F40-641D38DACB86

Injectors from behind.
The conversion is a Prins kit and was fitted by a registered installer in Warrington.
 
A reasonable investment then, what kind of mileage do you do then, just thinking how long it would take to pay for itself ?
Any downsides to it ? How are you finding the power and driveability when on gas ?
 
It's about the price of 447 gallons of unleaded so if you work on average of 26mpg then that would be 11630 miles. Depending on the annual mileage it should easily pay for itself within 2 yrs.

Edit: Igonre that, I'm mathematicing while under the influence, it of course means nothing of the sort as it depends on the difference in price between the two so will be a much higher mileage than that!

Edit to the edit: Googling suggests it's half the price of unleaded so my addled brain works the mileage payback as about 23000 miles but I'll do it again tomorrow when I've got got all my faculties
 
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Now I’m awake I stand by that last calculation 23-24000 miles payback. There are other variables that may affect this

1) My guess of 26mpg may not be what you are getting, higher or lower than this will obvious change the calculation in either direction. The last time I had any involvement with LPG conversions was my ex father-in-law-laws Discovery V8 nearly 20 yrs ago and we found then that it would do 2-3mpg less while on LPG than on petrol. If this is still the case then this adversely affects payback time. Also, it had to start on petrol before automatically switching over to gas when it was running, so you always had to have petrol in the tank. I assume things have improved since then and that’s no longer the case.

2) It assumes a differential of 65p. Obviously the cost of fuel will rise in the future but this doesn’t affect the calculation itself, only if the difference between the two changes. Again, back when I got to drive that Disco, LPG was a third of the price of petrol so on a car like the horrendously thirsty V8 Disco it was an absolute no brainer.

3) Any additional maintenance required for the conversion would add to the payback time, but I don’t remember any particular problems.

4) Resale value - the great intangible. Some people will tell you you will get all the money back when you sell, thus making payback instant. Those people tend to own a vehicle with it fitted, or are involved in selling them. Others will tell you that not only will you not get any of it back, but its presence will make it harder to sell. The truth is probably somewhere in between and really depends on the buyer, but it’s always safer to assume that any major modification like this will not add anything to the resale value and not bank on that in your calculations.

So based on the supposed national average mileage of 10000 (who only does that?) you’re looking at a payback of around 2.5 years.
 
I'm expecting about 2 years to break even (at 10K to 12K miles a year) - but I'm probably not going to record the relative prices etc. each time I fill up, so I'll never know for sure. LPG prices near to me are 60p/l with the cheapest (yet to be confirmed) apparently 52p. Motorway service station prices are about 70p. For the first few tanks, I'll be running it dry (to where the system beeps at me and automatically switches to petrol) to get an idea of the LPG range. The contents guage resolution is not the best, being just 5 bars across the top of the status button, so using the trip meter will help me get the most out of each tank.

On my 80 mile commute to work this morning, there was no noticeable differance in performance, either on the motorway or under hard acceleration in sport mode.
 
Nice one Shaun, I'll post pics of mine once I collect it tomorrow. Still a bit gutted I can't have as bigger LPG tank with my lowered suspension, but I guess it's only about 30-50 miles difference in range.
 
This has certainly got me thinking :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

My TSI van has a pendle remap, don't suppose they mentioned if there are any known complications with remapped vehicles on LPG?
 
4ndy said:
Any pictures @Euan Holmes
Click to expand...
Not yet. Mine’s done with the same kit as Shaun, it was me who recommended it on the forum way back, and Shaun and I have been chatting and comparing notes throughout. I would say its worth saying that the cost is variable, as I got three quotes on this system, ranging from £1800+VAT, through to £2,800+VAT, for the same thing!! I went with the former, and the garage in Oxford was great, very professional. I haven’t taken any pics yet, will try to upload later, but filler placement, tank etc are all the same as Shaun’s but mine’s got a slightly smaller tank, as mine’s 50-60mm lowered and the bigger tank would have been too low for the minimum LPG tank ground clearance regulations.
Re remapping, there’s almost no literature online (after LOTS of searching) about remapping direct injection LPG’d engines. My converter seemed to think it’s no worry, and to just crack on, but I’m a little bit more hesitant, as I’ve read the Keihin injectors are only rated up to a certain power output and injection limit, and with the remap taking power and torque up by about 50%, I’m concerned they’d not deliver enough LPG and/or fuel mixture, and may get temperature issues. Problem is, no one seems to know, so if I do it, it would take a really experienced mapper to experiment somewhat. Considering dropping Pendle a note to see if he fancies a project as I would like to have the 300bhp+ power and the cheap running costs :)
 
I am also interested in a remap, though after fitting air suspension (converter not so worried as height can be raised for speed bumps or ramps etc.). Pendle Performance are based in Barnoldswick (I believe), which is close to me and I would like to think that they would relish the challenge of mapping a TSi with LPG conversion. It might not be possible to get the full 300hp, but maybe somewhere in between.
 
An update for anyone curious. After having my van LPG converted, I had it remapped by Pendle, but only running on Pendle. Since, it's been in with a guru in Prins UK, and the LPG is calibrated to run the remap too, so I'm now running ~330bhp, 490lbft torque, and still averaging 25-30mpg, which in real terms is about 60-75mpg when LPG is currently >2.5x cheaper than basic unleaded!
So chuffed. Fast, frugal, and a pleasure to drive.
I'll report back soon re reliability, but so far so good (touch wood!)
 
Euan Holmes said:
An update for anyone curious. After having my van LPG converted, I had it remapped by Pendle, but only running on Pendle. Since, it's been in with a guru in Prins UK, and the LPG is calibrated to run the remap too, so I'm now running ~330bhp, 490lbft torque, and still averaging 25-30mpg, which in real terms is about 60-75mpg when LPG is currently >2.5x cheaper than basic unleaded!
So chuffed. Fast, frugal, and a pleasure to drive.
I'll report back soon re reliability, but so far so good (touch wood!)
Click to expand...


Hi Euan, I've been reading your remarks on the remaped TSI an lpg conversion.
I have a TSI it’s been remaped before I bought it but don’t know where. I want to lpg it.
Where did you have your done and was it just a standard conversion? I want to convert but are concerned it won’t run correctly with the remap.
Any advice would be appreciated.

Cheers Doug
 
Ragadyman said:
Hi Euan, I've been reading your remarks on the remaped TSI an lpg conversion.
I have a TSI it’s been remaped before I bought it but don’t know where. I want to lpg it.
Where did you have your done and was it just a standard conversion? I want to convert but are concerned it won’t run correctly with the remap.
Any advice would be appreciated.

Cheers Doug
Click to expand...

Hi Doug,
You should be fine I would think. Speak with the guru Bruce at Alternatech (01962676143), and they can do the Prins LPG conversion, as well as recalibrate it to run with your remap. As long as your remap isn't running silly boost levels, you'll be fine on the standard LPG kit and injectors. My Pendle map runs very sensible boost so runs like a dream.
I only used Bruce for the recalibration, after having had my conversion done by Colin at Oxford autogas. I only found out about Bruce afterwards, otherwise for ease I might have had Bruce do it all.
Good luck, you won't regret it, especially not the first time you fill up and it's under £30 lol
 
Euan Holmes said:
Hi Doug,
You should be fine I would think. Speak with the guru Bruce at Alternatech (01962676143), and they can do the Prins LPG conversion, as well as recalibrate it to run with your remap. As long as your remap isn't running silly boost levels, you'll be fine on the standard LPG kit and injectors. My Pendle map runs very sensible boost so runs like a dream.
I only used Bruce for the recalibration, after having had my conversion done by Colin at Oxford autogas. I only found out about Bruce afterwards, otherwise for ease I might have had Bruce do it all.
Good luck, you won't regret it, especially not the first time you fill up and it's under £30 lol
Click to expand...

Cheers Euan.
 
I love what you have done but Le Shuttle rules are a factor for me ..

“Can I travel in my LPG vehicle?
We do not accept any vehicles that are fitted with LPG or dual fuel tanks. If ever Eurotunnel Le Shuttle decides to make a change to the LPG policy, it will be made public, and customers will be informed.”


There seem to be different rules for gas as ‘vehicle’ fuel compared to ‘camping’ fuel

Fixed gas containers (tanks, etc.)
  • For the purposes of this text, this means fixed containers that are permanently installed or fixed in a vehicle and are refillable from outside the vehicle.

    The quantity of gas is limited to 47kg (or approximately 93 litres) maximum for a single container and to 50kg (or approximately 99 litres) maximum in the case of several containers. Each container must be no more than 80% full.

    The quantity will be checked via the gauge or remote indicator but if neither are present, the vehicle will be refused.
 
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