Lumpy engine start and idle

shaiboyuk

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Hi all,

Need you guys/gals advice, looked at other posts but not full covered elsewhere so here goes :)

For past month had issues with lumpy start and idle on my 2019 2.0 TDI (CXHA) BMT 150 Edition Kombi

History...

Van came out VW garage end of Nov 24 after service, mot and v-belt and tensioner replacement under warranty. All fine till start of second week in Dec 24, when the DPF warning came on dash

01.jpg

Van has only 34k on clock and in all that time, never had DPF warning come on, even though I do a lot of short journeys :/

Checking the VAG DPF App, it showed the DPF was defo needing a clear out (regen)...

02.jpg

So after 10-15 mins down the motorway, all cleared (but only goes down to 33-34% after regen these days)

03.jpg

A week later the rough start/idle started. It seemed to happen when engine was cold, once up to temperature it idled fine. VAG DPF showed DPF fine, and scan with VCDS shows no errors. So thought I would get a diesel treatment to clear things out, so got VW Diesel Additive (G 001 790 M3).

04.jpeg

Ran it through full tank of fuel, but unfortunately lumpiness is still there. Found that if I start van, and keep revs at around 2000rpm for 2-3 mins, will clear most of the lumpiness. Revs from idle up around 1800rpm are very lumpy before this and if drive away like this can feel it at gear changes.

Checking coolant, still red and no smell of fuel or oil.
Checking oil, at correct level, slight condensation at filer from short journeys, but no smell of fuel.
Dipping clutch when rough idle doesn't change the roughness.

So thought would try another cleaner about a week ago, Forte Diesel Specialist Injector Cleaner, into another fuel tank of fuel.

05.jpg<05>

Only been a few days and around 100 miles, but doesn't seem much difference, maybe a little quicker for the lumpiness to go away.

To me, with the revving to clear it, it seems to be fuel related, maybe injector? But going by other issues, could it be DPF/EGR related? Or something else?

Trying to get van booking in a VW, as has All In One warranty, so hopefully, it will be something that will covered. But if I can sort it myself before then plus plus.

Thanks for any help.
Paul
 
Interesting... Short journeys defo clog everything up.

I was given a bottle of that VW cleaner when I had a new engine fitted.... Bout another 5x bottles. And also a box of redex derv fuel additive. Not sure how effective any of it it. (The garage recommended using a bottle every three months, but I just them all on each tank over 10 tanks of fuel)

Keeps us posted.

If you have VCDS, @mmi is an expert at interpretation of block maps and data analytics.

He may see something in the data for the rough cold idle?
 
Think I also remember a post on here with a similar issue ...

I think it was the timing belt out by one tooth?

So mechanical and not electrical.
 
Think I also remember a post on here with a similar issue ...

I think it was the timing belt out by one tooth?

So mechanical and not electrical.
Would the timing being out not cause a constant issue? and not one that goes away after revving or heating up? :/
 
I'll have to try and find the recent thread..

It was similar. Poor running when cold.


. Anyone help find it?
 
Think I also remember a post on here with a similar issue ...

I think it was the timing belt out by one tooth?

Perhaps this one - though not a tooth out. I'm not sure if the engine would even start then - camshaft cog wheel has 44 teeth - being one off would equal to 8.2 degrees?
 
Yeh if I can do some logs in vcds, will do, but never done them before (virgin :eek: ) so @mmi go easy on me :p
To get started perhaps the basic ones first



Please share

(1) full VCDS Auto-Scan
(2) engine blockmap data - ignition ON, engine OFF
(3) engine blockmap data - engine running at idle



How-to for (1)



How-to for (2) and (3):

VCDS > Applications > Controller Channel Map >

For "Single controller address" - enter 01

1726335099950.png


Tick/fill boxes as above and click Go.

VCDS flashes screens for a moment (when finished hit "Done, Go Back") and there should be a file blockmap-01-... in folder C:\Ross-Tech\VCDS\Logs\....

Note: only VCDS HEX-V2 and VCDS HEX-NET cables have the capability to create blockmap files.
 
So after 10-15 mins down the motorway, all cleared (but only goes down to 33-34% after regen these days)

03.jpg
Based on the numbers it seems the normal soot calculated range on this engine for active DPF regeneration is from 9 to 30 grams. Thus DPF regen is triggered at 30 grams of soot calculated.

The app's percentage calculation seems to assume a range of 0...24 grams. In the app only upper limit can be adjusted (under Settings - Field regeration limit).
 
Was playing with vag dpf yesterday...

I have a new engine and new dpf etc...

Here's pics for ref..


....


Screenshot_20250117_150430_VAG DPF.jpgScreenshot_20250117_145450_VAG DPF.jpgScreenshot_20250117_084426_VAG DPF.jpgScreenshot_20250117_070542_Email.jpg


.....
 
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To get started perhaps the basic ones first



Please share

(1) full VCDS Auto-Scan
(2) engine blockmap data - ignition ON, engine OFF
(3) engine blockmap data - engine running at idle

Ok done these, so much data in them, I don't know where to start hopefully @mmi you do hehe

ignore the "Headlight Range" fault, aware its a wiring issue which I still need to find, as VW won't cover that in warranty :mad:

Thanks for your help sir
 

Attachments

  • blockmap-01-04L-906-056-RJ_WV1ZZZ7HZKH185023-20250118-1701-IGN-ON-ENG-IDLE.CSV
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  • blockmap-01-04L-906-056-RJ_WV1ZZZ7HZKH185023-20250118-1655-IGN-ON-ENG-OFF.CSV
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  • Log-WV1ZZZ7HZKH185023-56870km-35337mi-t6-forum-scan.txt
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just a quick note on the headlight issues.

its saying there is a problem with the ride height sensor,

there is one on each susspension arm front and back . . passenger side i think.#

have a quick look under there and get a pic or two . .

the second fault is the basic headlight settings,. . . which relate to the first issue.


could be a damaged sensor or wire . . .

they look like this. . .

1737226294123.png1737226419545.png1737226306752.png





++++++++++


Address 55: Headlight Range (J431) Labels:. 6R0-907-357.clb
Part No SW: 6R0 907 357 C HW: 6R0 907 357 B
Component: AFS-ECU 005 0050
Revision: -------- Serial number: -------------- Dataset Number: V03935288UG 0001
Coding: 0FCE020001000000
Shop #: WSC 25904 005 1048576
ASAM Dataset: EV_HeadlRegulVWLWRCC 002006
ROD: EV_HeadlRegulVWLWRCC.rod
VCID: 3A2D384A3CD1EE8A51F-806F

2 Faults Found:
5275220 - Headlight
C107E 54 [10001001] - Missing Calibration / Basic Setting
MIL ON - Confirmed - Tested Since Memory Clear
Freeze Frame:
Fault Priority: 1
Fault Frequency: 1
Reset counter: 133
Mileage: 56871 km
Date: 2025.01.18.
Time: 16:51:25

5275409 - Supply Voltage for Vehicle Ride Height Sensor
C107F 11 [10001001] - Short to Ground
MIL ON - Confirmed - Tested Since Memory Clear
Freeze Frame:
Fault Priority: 2
Fault Frequency: 1
Reset counter: 133
Mileage: 56871 km
Date: 2025.01.18.
Time: 16:51:24


+++++++++++++++++


more info on the sensor







.
 
just a quick note on the headlight issues.

its saying there is a problem with the ride height sensor,

there is one on each susspension arm front and back . . passenger side i think.#

have a quick look under there and get a pic or two . .

the second fault is the basic headlight settings,. . . which relate to the first issue.

could be a damaged sensor or wire . . .

Thanks, Yeh sensor been replaced by VW, then they found that front sensor has power (5v I think they said) but the back sensor didn't have power. Quoted silly money to trace break, so said I would do it myself, will get round to that lol
 
Ok done these, so much data in them, I don't know where to start hopefully @mmi you do hehe

ignore the "Headlight Range" fault, aware its a wiring issue which I still need to find, as VW won't cover that in warranty :mad:

Thanks for your help sir

Thanks for the massive data package. Nothing obvious which would explain lumpy running.

Let's have a closer look into how the engine is actually running. Would be great if you can catch a lumpy startup and idling using the recording package below.

Please make a recording as follows:

Turn IGN on -

VCDS > Select > Engine > Adv. Meas. Values >

Tick the following items

IDE00083 Throttle valve position (absolute)​
IDE00347 Air mass: actual value​
IDE00351 Main injection: start of activation​
IDE00352 Main injection: duration of activation​
IDE00589 Fuel pressure​
IDE07738 Charge air cooler inlet: pressure sensor 1 bank 1: raw value​
IDE07742 Cylinder head: pressure sensor 3 bank 1: raw value​
IDE07744 Particle filter: air pressure sensor 1 bank 1: raw value​
ENG126008 IN_Injection_speed_injector[0]​
ENG126009 IN_Injection_speed_injector[1]​
ENG126010 IN_Injection_speed_injector[2]​
ENG128778 IN_Injection_speed_injector[3]​


Tick Group UDS requests by 7 (or 8, whichever value keeps data alive)
1737232070544.png

Click Log - Start !!!

Start the engine - let it run for 3 minutes.

Stop logging etc.

The logfile will be in folder C:\Ross-Tech\VCDS\Logs
 
Thanks for the massive data package. Nothing obvious which would explain lumpy running.

Let's have a closer look into how the engine is actually running. Would be great if you can catch a lumpy startup and idling using the recording package below.

Please make a recording as follows:
Thanks sir, been out in van today so will leave it till morning so its extra lumpy (the engine) :p
 
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