4motion - Manual Or Dsg ??

[Tiger-G]

Hi

I know this has been done before, and yes I've used the search facility, but my questions weren't really answered, and I'd really like some up to date info on whether to buy a manual or DSG 4motion now that the T6 has been round a bit.

I'm looking for a T6 LWB 4motion with (most importantly) a diff lock to use as a camper /day van. Although I won't be going off-road every day, I want to be in a position that if I do, I won't get stuck. The places I like to get to can be quite remote and off the beaten track.

I've only ever had cars with a manual gearbox, and have always thought that automatics were for old farts. I like the fact that with a manual you are always involved in the driving, you are always in total control, you can tow / jump start, you can rev to the red line to crack on, etc. But guess what......I'm an old fart now !! . I'm getting sick of forever changing gear in the limited rev range that is a diesel, my boy racer days are (almost) over, and I want a more relaxed drive for touring.

I'd like to hear people people's opinions on the pro's and con's of manuals and DSG, but specifically related to 4motions. I'm not sure if having a diff lock involved makes much of a difference......unless you're stuck of course !!??

I've read that DSG's have a few issues when reversing, have a bit of lag, and no doubt won't have the precision of a manual box ??
What's the reliability like on the DSG's ??
Does the DSG work well with 4motion in tricky conditions. If I was stuck somewhere would I be able to "rock" a DSG out of a hole by quickly changing between forward and reverse, can you actually change quickly between forward and reverse like in a manual ??
Could someone tow me out of a hole if I have a DSG ??
Do DSG owners miss having a manual gearbox, and do manual owners wish they had DSG ??

A few questions there I hope you can help me with

Cheers,
Graeme.

 

[Keeff]

I always have manual but had a DSG on loan the other day . I found it ok on the open road but in town all it did was change gear all the time and drove me made . I would have a good test drive before buying one . Not got 4 motion so cannot help with that. Did have a go with it in manual but with seven gear it could do with paddles on the wheel.
I do find the clutch and the gear change very good on the t6 so fun to drive.

 

[JSJQ]

Hi Graeme,
I am in Australia and have a new T6 132kw 4motion T6 DSG but no diff lock. Reversing on steep slopes is a bit tricky compared to other vehicles I have owned. When I attempt to move I have to keep pushing down on the accelerator and then suddenly you are off with a rush. The same happens when moving forward with the revs shooting up and then having to ease off quickly on the accelerator. I find it a bit disconcerting to say the least. It means I probably need to get used to it by adjusting my driving style.

My wife and I hired a T6 camper and spent three weeks in the Outer Hebrides last year. It was the smallest motor in the range (don’t know the designation) and manual. I was surprised by the good performance of the vehicle and the fuel consumption was excellent. I attributed these factors partly to the vehicle being a manual. It certainly had more “precision” now that you mention it. And yes,it was fun to drive.

Regards,

John

PS Agree with Keef.

 

[dubber36]

DSG all the way for me. You do need to 'learn' how to drive it tho'. It will be frustrating to begin with and will do things that you don't think it should. Keeff said his changed gear all the time. Well, I'd say that's more down to him than the van. It takes a few weeks to subconsciously adapt, but once you've got it, you won't look back.

Reversing a trailer up a slope can be a bit tricky to get right. If you start off too slowly, you'll compress the coupling and put the trailers brakes on, meaning you'll have to pull forward a touch and go again. But again, that's something you'll learn to get right.

 

[t0mb0]

DSG all the way. However, in the UK, the 4motion/DSG combination is only available with the 204 engine so that can be an expensive jump if you weren’t already looking at a 204...

 

[buchanan84]

^ and the 180 engine

 

[czmate1999]

DSG is great for long journeys and with the ACC. Haven’t used mine off road yet but I test drive manuals and DSG and for me the difference was night and day - in terms of driving experience. DSG all the way.

 

[Ian28]

Got the manual 4motion with diff lock - love it. Haven’t yet driven an automatic as responsive as I am. I enjoy driving so manual all day long for me!

 

[Tiger-G]

I always have manual but had a DSG on loan the other day . I found it ok on the open road but in town all it did was change gear all the time and drove me made . I would have a good test drive before buying one . Not got 4 motion so cannot help with that. Did have a go with it in manual but with seven gear it could do with paddles on the wheel.
I do find the clutch and the gear change very good on the t6 so fun to drive.

Hmmmm........I wonder what it would be like on rural "A" & "B" roads in Scotland for instance. Changes in speed on bends, inclines, etc, wonder if it would be up and down the box all the time ??

 

[Tiger-G]

Hi Graeme,
I am in Australia and have a new T6 132kw 4motion T6 DSG but no diff lock. Reversing on steep slopes is a bit tricky compared to other vehicles I have owned. When I attempt to move I have to keep pushing down on the accelerator and then suddenly you are off with a rush. The same happens when moving forward with the revs shooting up and then having to ease off quickly on the accelerator. I find it a bit disconcerting to say the least. It means I probably need to get used to it by adjusting my driving style.

My wife and I hired a T6 camper and spent three weeks in the Outer Hebrides last year. It was the smallest motor in the range (don’t know the designation) and manual. I was surprised by the good performance of the vehicle and the fuel consumption was excellent. I attributed these factors partly to the vehicle being a manual. It certainly had more “precision” now that you mention it. And yes,it was fun to drive.

Regards,

John

PS Agree with Keef.

Thanks for the reply John, I'd read that they struggle in reverse. As mentioned in other replies, I wonder if it's something I could just get used to ??

Have you ever had the 4motion somewhere a two wheel drive may have struggled grip wise, and if so, how did you get on ??

 

[ei-aprilia]

Hmmmm........I wonder what it would be like on rural "A" & "B" roads in Scotland for instance. Changes in speed on bends, inclines, etc, wonder if it would be up and down the box all the time ??

OK so I've had both manual and dsg 4motions. Work dictates I go in and out of very muddy (sometimes) and hilly places. My vans are pretty laden with tools and materials so definitely on the heavier end of the spectrum. I'd say the manual is marginally better off road but only marginally. The dsg is still excellent and I've never come unstuck. A lot of this comes down to sensible tyre choice and driving style.
With dsg if you stick it in reverse, wait a second before you hit the accelerator and it will move perfectly, if you push the accelerator too soon it needs more revs then shoots back.
Diff lock is great too, you really notice when it's engaged, the van just wants to go in a straight line.
I believe the dsg adapts to your driving style so if you nail the pedal everywhere it will change gears a lot, be a bit more gentle and the gear changes will be smother and less frequent.
I love the dsg, I wouldn't have another manual, I live in rural Scotland and most of my driving is in the hills on A & B roads. Fully laden 204, I get roughly 28mpg on a short journey, 36 mpg on a longer journey say 50miles ish
HTH
Ian

 

[Tiger-G]

DSG all the way. However, in the UK, the 4motion/DSG combination is only available with the 204 engine so that can be an expensive jump if you weren’t already looking at a 204...

Hmmmm......didn't realise that. Quite fuel thirsty the 204's, but quite nippy from what I've read. I do like to crack a bit on rural roads, but wonder what that would feel like in a two tonne van ?? I was going to go for the 150 and just get it remapped.......

 

[czmate1999]

Hmmmm......didn't realise that. Quite fuel thirsty the 204's, but quite nippy from what I've read. I do like to crack a bit on rural roads, but wonder what that would feel like in a two tonne van ?? I was going to go for the 150 and just get it remapped.......

If your going for a nearly new van I would wait for the warranty to finish before the remap...

 

[Tiger-G]

DSG is great for long journeys and with the ACC. Haven’t used mine off road yet but I test drive manuals and DSG and for me the difference was night and day - in terms of driving experience. DSG all the way.

Thanks for that

 

[Tiger-G]

If your going for a nearly new van I would wait for the warranty to finish before the remap...

Yeah, I've read that a few times before on other forums. It shows on the ECU when they're plugged in for servicing

 

[Tiger-G]

DSG all the way for me. You do need to 'learn' how to drive it tho'. It will be frustrating to begin with and will do things that you don't think it should. Keeff said his changed gear all the time. Well, I'd say that's more down to him than the van. It takes a few weeks to subconsciously adapt, but once you've got it, you won't look back.

Reversing a trailer up a slope can be a bit tricky to get right. If you start off too slowly, you'll compress the coupling and put the trailers brakes on, meaning you'll have to pull forward a touch and go again. But again, that's something you'll learn to get right.

Good stuff. The thought of not having to change gear every two seconds is starting to sound appealing

 

[Tiger-G]

OK so I've had both manual and dsg 4motions. Work dictates I go in and out of very muddy (sometimes) and hilly places. My vans are pretty laden with tools and materials so definitely on the heavier end of the spectrum. I'd say the manual is marginally better off road but only marginally. The dsg is still excellent and I've never come unstuck. A lot of this comes down to sensible tyre choice and driving style.
With dsg if you stick it in reverse, wait a second before you hit the accelerator and it will move perfectly, if you push the accelerator too soon it needs more revs then shoots back.
Diff lock is great too, you really notice when it's engaged, the van just wants to go in a straight line.
I believe the dsg adapts to your driving style so if you nail the pedal everywhere it will change gears a lot, be a bit more gentle and the gear changes will be smother and less frequent.
I love the dsg, I wouldn't have another manual, I live in rural Scotland and most of my driving is in the hills on A & B roads. Fully laden 204, I get roughly 28mpg on a short journey, 36 mpg on a longer journey say 50miles ish
HTH
Ian

That's great information mate, and just what I want to hear. I spend a lot of time in rural Scotland in the summer, so that's where I'll be heading with the van. You're right about tyre choice too, an appropriate set of tyres can get you out of sticky situations even without 4motion and a diff lock

 

[Jean-Louis Bourdon]

used to have an automatic bmw 1 series.
loved it till it started to go wrong

my T6 is 4 motion, with the extra mechanical diff lock and manual.
and yes, it feels a bit prehistoric having to change gear, but i think it's the best combination.

 

[JSJQ]

Some good advice here re reverse. I’ll give the pause then accelerate a go.

The “received wisdom” in Australia is that automatics are better in sand than manuals as they won’t stall. I would imagine the for and aft shuffle using the dsg would be easier than the manual if the vehicle is stuck. As said above and in other places, the choice of tyres is often the determining factor not the gear box.

However, Im loving the dsg.

 

[Dannyb6467]

I have a dsg 4Motion and love it.
I'm doing 40k a year on motorways then off road pulling trailers at least twice a week. The manual box will always be better or let's say more flexible if you're off road but each gearbox has its pros and con . Overall, given my needs dsg every time.
As others have said, the dsg does seem to make some strange decisions but you will get used to them to the point where you know what's going to happen and adjust the revs to compensate. I have 1 particular road that the gearbox changes down to 2nd as it thinks I need engine braking....I don't so just accelerate hard for a split second and it goes to 4th....perfect.
When I'm towing a few ton off road i use the dsg in manual anyway. Dsg does not like reversing heavy trailers, especially if you're a shuffler! Constant speed and revs it's fine. Dsg would love a low box though !
If theres anything specific you want you know I may have been in the situation so ask away.