I think these cheap leases are the way to go for people wanting to try out electric, but what's going to happen to all these cars and vans when they get handed back? I can't see a decent secondhand market for them, so how is that sustainable?
ABT eTransporter 6.1
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EVs generally don't depreciate any worse than petrol or diesel cars and a lot of cases do much better.
That will change very soon when people realise that used EVs of an age will need a battery pack, which will cost almost as much as the vehicle itself is worth.
Just go and drive one. It’s way off the mark of other electric vehicles.
My point was more to do with the type of person that buys second hand vehicles now, is unlikely to be the sort of person that would take a chance on a second hand EV in a couple of years time. If that is the case, who's going to buy all the 2 year old EVs when they get handed back after the lease period?
This isn't a non-issue but is generally quite an overhyped problem. e.g. my Leaf that's 5 years old and 60K miles still has full bars. And that's in a car that doesn't even have battery cooling and also batteries have improved quite a bit lately. Also as time goes by battery prices are falling quite steeply and there are more specialists appearing for battery swaps.
The depreciation is determined entirely by the demand. So obviously people already are buying them.
What is an issue is the recharging infrastructure.
More likely artificially low depreciation to try to convince the masses that they are a good idea. With relatively low volume of EVs about, there only needs to be a very small proportion of the used vehicle market to (for whatever their reasons) take one on.
More likely artificially low depreciation to try to convince the masses that they are a good idea. With relatively low volume of EVs about, there only needs to be a very small proportion of the used vehicle market to (for whatever their reasons) take one on.
I'm not sure what any of that means. Is there some secret government cabal going round car dealers telling them how to price Teslas or something?
It definitely is. I'm not sure I'd have one yet if I didn't have a driveway or at least somewhere really easy and cheap nearby to charge it. However it is improving as range increases and charging times decrease. But for use as our main car that does 80% of our miles that are within about 40miles of home it's an absolute no-brainer. Still keep an ICE one right now but it's only used when it needs to be.
Porsche dealers are renowned for inflating used prices to sell new cars based on low depreciation.
A friend of mine has a Macan, bought new around 2 years ago. "You'll get back pretty much all you paid for it in a couple of years time" says the salesman pointing round his forecourt as he signed on the dotted line. He's looking to change for another one now and every dealer he's been to is offering him over £10k less than the price of the equivalent used car they have for sale. I guess people will only get caught once.
What I'm saying about EV's is that at the moment there are not that many about, therefore not that many used ones. Lets say there are 5% EVs on the road compared to ICE vehicles. You only need 5% of the used car buying market to buy them. The likelihood is, those 5% will be the sort of people that will be prepared to pay more money and leap into the unknown than many of the remaining 95%. As more and more used EVs come to market at the end of lease deals, I don't think that there will be enough buyers out of the 95% that will be willing to take them on. That will either result in much reduced prices, or compounds full of used vehicles, unsold, whilst manufactures are still churning out even more new ones.
A friend of mine has a Macan, bought new around 2 years ago. "You'll get back pretty much all you paid for it in a couple of years time" says the salesman pointing round his forecourt as he signed on the dotted line. He's looking to change for another one now and every dealer he's been to is offering him over £10k less than the price of the equivalent used car they have for sale. I guess people will only get caught once.
What I'm saying about EV's is that at the moment there are not that many about, therefore not that many used ones. Lets say there are 5% EVs on the road compared to ICE vehicles. You only need 5% of the used car buying market to buy them. The likelihood is, those 5% will be the sort of people that will be prepared to pay more money and leap into the unknown than many of the remaining 95%. As more and more used EVs come to market at the end of lease deals, I don't think that there will be enough buyers out of the 95% that will be willing to take them on. That will either result in much reduced prices, or compounds full of used vehicles, unsold, whilst manufactures are still churning out even more new ones.
Doubt it. It'll be petrol and diesel cars that will become less desirable.
Thing is these lease deals are only so cheap due to the 6k government grant. Once that goes then the current lease deal will double making 2nd hand look more attractive. That being said I'm getting a bit peeved that both diesel and electric these days are only expected to last 100k before requiring a major outlay to keep them on the road. My last van (transit) did me to 180k without much going wrong.
I thought 2.5k was the maximum grant now. In any case it'll not be long at all now before it reaches the point where EVs are actually cheaper to produce. The mechanical complexity of modern IC engines is absolutely mind-boggling in comparison.
For the past 6 months I’ve been debating whether to ask the neighbours if they want to chip in and get rid of a quarter the gardens to make for room for parking and charging points etc. I would love an electric car…. In time i know i will 
Listening to Jeremy Vine the other week, there was a fella on there saying that the range is acceptable to most people with short commutes (which I completely get) and that cost of ownership of a new one over 2-3 years could be cheaper than a similar ICE vehicle. (I get that too)
But what everyone fails to mention is that there are many people that just don't have the money to buy/lease a new vehicle. Whilst many are able to pay out £400 a month to lease a new car, to many £400 a year to fund and service a car to get them to work is as much as they can manage. For that reason there will be a great demand for used ICE vehicles for at least 20 years. 20 years seem like a long time? There are still plenty of 51 plate cars with many more miles left in them.
But what everyone fails to mention is that there are many people that just don't have the money to buy/lease a new vehicle. Whilst many are able to pay out £400 a month to lease a new car, to many £400 a year to fund and service a car to get them to work is as much as they can manage. For that reason there will be a great demand for used ICE vehicles for at least 20 years. 20 years seem like a long time? There are still plenty of 51 plate cars with many more miles left in them.
Yes if we have a back garden we would have problems. A solution will be found in time, such as taking up the roads for charging points outside every house just like virgin media have done. But the poor always last in queue for modern technology
I agree with you generally. But this thread was predominantly about the eTransporter - a vehicle that is already way behind technology and range wise where almost all current EVs are. They are struggling to get rid of them today because they are already outdated in almost every respect. In 2 years time, today's eTransporter will be absolutely worthless and pointless because it will be so outdated for an EV. In 2 years time there is likely to still be strong demand for ICE vans, particularly used ones. The eTransporters that come back off lease in 2 years time will be purchasable ridiculously cheaply I suspect.
Oh yeah, absolutely agree about that particular van. Struggling to think of many uses for it. 80 miles of stated range is hardly anything really, a loaded van speeding up and slowing down in traffic will go hardly anywhere even just bobbing about locally. I suppose a tradesman who serves a small area might be able to make use of it but if they find themselves having to go out of town to pick up some supplies or something then they might be in for a long day indeed.
If they're cheap enough used though then it might be viable for some clever people to be able to do something with extra battery packs or something but it'll eat into the load space a bit.
Someone mentioned before they will probably be okay for an airport or something which is probably about right. Zip around a bit and then straight back on charge
I have the advance on a 2 year lease, range appears to be on point and for how we use it isn’t a problem, insurance seems very reasonable to me, can’t say it was loaded at all.I've been looking at the advance which comes in at under £280 per month on this lease. Factor in no road tax (£20 pm) and fuel savings and you could easily be seeing that monthly cost drop to £220 per month if you are on an economy 7 type electricity plan. VW have partnered with Octopus energy to offer such a plan which works out at 2p per mile to recharge at night but would need to investigate how this affects the remaining household usage using the day tariff.
The real underlying factor here is the range. Claimed at 80 miles but fully loaded who knows? BHP is 110 but someone here (was it @BognorMotors?) said it's acceleration is poor and again fully loaded would be even worse.
Another thing to consider is the insurance cost. Is there a hike on electric vehicles?
I too would love to hear your views on your experiences @DaveR.
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