Basic no-leisure battery setup

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WHSE

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T6 Pro
Hi all,

Does anybody have advice for (or against!) a simple kombi day van setup where there are lights, 12v and USB ports in the back of the van running from the engine battery?

I'm looking to avoid a full leisure battery setup as it's unlikely we will need it. We will take a 12v fridge when we camp and I'm thinking of just plumbing the engine battery into the on-site hookups using a ctek charger or similar so the drain doesn't empty it.

Am I missing a trick trying to avoid a leisure battery?
 
WHSE said:
I'm looking to avoid a full leisure battery setup as it's unlikely we will need it.
Click to expand...
WHSE said:
We will take a 12v fridge
Click to expand...
A fridge is a significant load and without hookup will flatten your starter battery within a day or so.
A fridge cycles on & off with its thermostat, and a charger cycles between up to 5 stages of charge based on the battery voltage it sees, as the fridge loads and unloads the battery. Meanwhile the ECU expects to maintain the starter battery at around 80% charge, despite this confusion of overall system drain/charge/float variations :)
A leisure battery frees you of all power concerns, leaves the ECU happy, and makes everything electrical so much easier. And if you do flatten it, your van will still start :)
 
Personally I'd have a separate system for the extra electrical items. That why it doesn't mess with the van electrics.
 
On my first conversion, I put a GoalZero Yeti battery in the back and connected the LED light circuit I added to that. The Yeti has USB so could just use an extender. Can charge from home mains, 12v socket or solar. Used all at some point. Worked well, but going for a leisure battery on the next conversion (probably a lithium one) to hide all the cables neatly.
 
My advice would be to fit a leisure battery in its simplest form probably under the left front seat. Old fashioned split charge relay controlled by the BCM if you can just like a California. You will then have all the flexibility to camp with the fridge and lights etc. just as long as the leisure battery will support it. That sounds cheap and crude but it's all VW fit on a Cali.
If the future requires a better system you can enhance it with a B2B unit, lithium and solar etc. as you need.
 
For a basic kit without major installations... you might just like to use a power unit @Dellmassive will be along soon, he has tested many of the power pack units, they have 240 /12v sockets, USB points simple 240v lead out to campsite electric Hook up Power then, run in some led strip lights.. Job Done.......you can even take the unit indoors and charge it... without touching your Van Power...... build your van to suit your needs.. keeping it simple and just Enjoy it......
 
Well thanks everyone. Really appreciate the range of ideas.

Additional weight has been a factor for me. I want the van to remain as driveable day to day as poss. My previous T6 full camper conversion felt a bit cumbersome but at the moment my Kombi feels great. I suppose picking the right battery would be key here, I.e. nothing so big that I'm adding unnecessary weight??
 
WHSE said:
Well thanks everyone. Really appreciate the range of ideas.

Additional weight has been a factor for me. I want the van to remain as driveable day to day as poss. My previous T6 full camper conversion felt a bit cumbersome but at the moment my Kombi feels great. I suppose picking the right battery would be key here, I.e. nothing so big that I'm adding unnecessary weight??
Click to expand...
Speak to @travelvolts for a keen price on batteries great service and back up for any questions. you might have

and stick the battery under the drivers seat. with a charger and smart rely and your done. Electrics | Travelvolts
 
I have two usb ports, a 12v socket, led spotlights and my Halo led strip powered from my starter battery. It was installed in a way that could easily be adapted to run off of a leisure battery when I get round to it.
It hasn't been an issue for me however, I set it up to only have power when the ignition was on. If not it is very easy to drain the battery without realising.
 
The loads you mention apart from the fridge will draw the best part of nothing from your starter battery..assuming you drive it regularly so the battery can be charged, you will be fine doing as you suggest. The fridge however will draw a fair amount of power, but as you mention that you plan to use it on sites with a hookup and your happy to invest in a decent charger, then again you will be fine as the energy the fridge is drawing will be outweighed by the power the charger is providing. Alternatively you could power your fridge directly from the hookup.

As everyone else is saying though, if you tried to use your fridge when parked up and not on a hookup, your starter battery will be flat in no time, so its up to you to police the operation of the fridge yourself or you might find your stranded somewhere with a flat battery.

You will want to make sure your starter battery is in good health though, perhaps even upgrade it to the largest AGM battery you can fit in the space. I recently upgraded mine (i squeezed a 95Ah in place of the stock 70Ah) as the old one had let me down a few times, i knew it was on its last legs, but having a leisure battery on board in those situations was a godsend as i could jump start myself :D
 
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Phil_G said:
A fridge is a significant load and without hookup will flatten your starter battery within a day or so.
A fridge cycles on & off with its thermostat, and a charger cycles between up to 5 stages of charge based on the battery voltage it sees, as the fridge loads and unloads the battery. Meanwhile the ECU expects to maintain the starter battery at around 80% charge, despite this confusion of overall system drain/charge/float variations :)
A leisure battery frees you of all power concerns, leaves the ECU happy, and makes everything electrical so much easier. And if you do flatten it, your van will still start :)
Click to expand...
I have a leisure battery in the T6. Thinking about getting a solar panel. Before I do, do you know if the portable charging packs (about £300) are able to connect to the leisure battery to give an extra day or so supply. Dont do a great deal of camping without electric hook up but thinking about music festivals next year? Advice and guidance please.
 
How did you get on with this one? I've built and used three campervans without leisure batteries. I've never used an electric hook-up and never had a flat battery. The last two had 12v/gas/230v fridges, gas water heater, gas air heater, water pump. Only the last one had LED lights. I'm now building another one and will add some solar panels, so that I can use an efficient domestic 230v fridge with an inverter, and keep the vehicle battery charged up from the solar panels. I just want a bit of advice about designing the solar setup, but every firm just wants to sell me an extra battery! If you are worried about a flat battery these days, you could easily carry a device the size of book that would restart your motor.
 
I didnt bother with a leisure battery in my last van.

I had the usual LED lights and 12v sockets powered from the van battery but protected by a victron battery guard so it would never be drained to the point I couldnt start the van.

I'm rarely parked up for long - I like to get out and about to explore so the engine would always have a good chance to make sure the little power used was topped up.

If you plan on camping with 240v anyway then why not use a 240v-12v adaptor and run your fridge off that? Much cheaper, less hassle, and for 90% of the time you'll probably be driving about without the fridge anyway (assuming your driving/camping mix there!).
 
rod_vw said:
My advice would be to fit a leisure battery in its simplest form probably under the left front seat. Old fashioned split charge relay controlled by the BCM if you can just like a California. You will then have all the flexibility to camp with the fridge and lights etc. just as long as the leisure battery will support it. That sounds cheap and crude but it's all VW fit on a Cali.
If the future requires a better system you can enhance it with a B2B unit, lithium and solar etc. as you need.
Click to expand...
What’s involved with this? And can it be bought as a kit? I’m coming from caravaning and what a super basic system. I have thought the portable battery pack is the way, but why I’m at carpeting point in the build I am thinking a basic EHU system is going to be worthwhile?
Many thanks
 
cossie said:
What’s involved with this? And can it be bought as a kit? I’m coming from caravaning and what a super basic system. I have thought the portable battery pack is the way, but why I’m at carpeting point in the build I am thinking a basic EHU system is going to be worthwhile?
Many thanks
Click to expand...
Alternator charging under the factory set up is basically: 100a fused connection from the starter battery (e-box fuses) going to a split charge relay with an ignition signal wire under the passenger seat, then to an 80a fuse, then to the leisure battery positive terminal.

Literally nothing more to it.

The normal upgrade from this is to do away with the relay, refit a fuse then run the starter battery feed to a DC-DC charger which will be more complex and smarter than the std factory relay.
 
Thanks for this, I might just have a go at putting in a basic setup. Where would be the best place to get a kit?
Thanks
 
A lot of threads on this area in the forum.

If you don't expect a lot of demand then there is a lot to be said for spending a season with a portable power pack and seeing what you use the van for and so therefore what you need.

If you do put a leisure battery in then unless you have something reasonably old you are likely to have a smart alternator (start/stop) at which point a basic charge relay and a lead acid battery is very compromised - it will only charge to about 80-85% and ideally don't discharge below 45-50% to avoid damage - leaving you a usable 30-40%

A DC-DC charger will charge to 100% (so 50% usable charge) and a change to LiFePo will let you discharge to 80% or a bit beyond and be smaller and lighter for that same capacity.

If you're going for a fixed install I'd strongly recommend at least putting a DC-DC charger in, it's the same amount of physical work and wiring.

Using a LiFePo battery over a lead acid is a bit more expenditure at the start (though prices are dropping) but will be much more effective and likely last much longer, 10 year lifespans for will looked after decent brand batteries are quoted and that's pretty much a lifetime purchase.
 
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