Courtesy Light Switch Options

[Skyliner33]

@Mccoatup That’s a great piece of work.
Is there a simpler way to do what I want. Ie just be able to use the 6 LEDs as courtesy lights and then be able to switch on and dim separately? Thanks.

 

[Mccoatup]

This should do it I think. Of course, you can just use relays rather than a relay board if you want to avoid a few mA being taken permanently but it's quite convenient having the screw connectors on the board to connect it all up.
This ciruit will switch your LEDs from being in parallel with the Van courtesy lights normally, to being driven from your leisure battery (if you have one). Assuming the courtesy lights are off, the switch will then let you turn your extra lghts on and off at will. And when the switch is on, the dimmer switch will then be operational. Is that what you were looking for?

 

[Skyliner33]

This should do it I think. Of course, you can just use relays rather than a relay board if you want to avoid a few mA being taken permanently but it's quite convenient having the screw connectors on the board to connect it all up.
This ciruit will switch your LEDs from being in parallel with the Van courtesy lights normally, to being driven from your leisure battery (if you have one). Assuming the courtesy lights are off, the switch will then let you turn your extra lghts on and off at will. And when the switch is on, the dimmer switch will then be operational. Is that what you were looking for?

Thanks that sounds pretty much like I’m looking for. I do have a leisure battery.

 

[The Van Cave]

Hi all, I have a similar requirement, perhaps you could help me out? I currently have 6 LED roof lights and a switch in the rear of my kombi and the lights come on with the original courtesy light when you open the doors / unlock the van and time out when the courtesy lights do. If I switch the switch in the back of the van they no longer work with the courtesy lights, they are simply always off.

I want to be able to use the lights in the back of the van whenever I choose to do so, without having one of the doors open. What would I need to do to be able to change the operation of the switch in the back of the van so that in position 1 the rear LEDs come on when doors open with the courtesy lights as they currently do, but in position 2 they are on rather than off as they are now? I do not have a leisure battery, so would this be too much drain on the starter battery if I were to have the roof lights on for say a couple of hours or so?

I get that this may seem really simple, but I am not good with electric circuits, much better with mechanical things, or a hammer!

 

[Skyliner33]

This should do it I think. Of course, you can just use relays rather than a relay board if you want to avoid a few mA being taken permanently but it's quite convenient having the screw connectors on the board to connect it all up.
This ciruit will switch your LEDs from being in parallel with the Van courtesy lights normally, to being driven from your leisure battery (if you have one). Assuming the courtesy lights are off, the switch will then let you turn your extra lghts on and off at will. And when the switch is on, the dimmer switch will then be operational. Is that what you were looking for?

Hi, I've been looking again at this and again thanks for the time in preparing the diagram.

I've been trying to plan this and have a couple of questions. I cant make diagrams as good as yours.

1. My dimmer switch has an on/off function as well as dimming. Its has 2 inputs and 2 outputs, the dimmer in your diagram has only 3 connections. How would I wire this? Is it possible to use this as the switch, S1 and the dimmer or do I need a separate switch S1?



2. I have completely removed the ceiling courtesy light fittings, so in the section:


Can the connection you have to the red / brown wire be move to before the filament lamp to the red / black as its basically just wire between them (although with a bit of resistance)? (ie line A)

3. Where does To Power Control Unit (B) connect to?

Thanks again for any help.

 

[Mccoatup]

Hi all, I have a similar requirement, perhaps you could help me out? I currently have 6 LED roof lights and a switch in the rear of my kombi and the lights come on with the original courtesy light when you open the doors / unlock the van and time out when the courtesy lights do. If I switch the switch in the back of the van they no longer work with the courtesy lights, they are simply always off.

I want to be able to use the lights in the back of the van whenever I choose to do so, without having one of the doors open. What would I need to do to be able to change the operation of the switch in the back of the van so that in position 1 the rear LEDs come on when doors open with the courtesy lights as they currently do, but in position 2 they are on rather than off as they are now? I do not have a leisure battery, so would this be too much drain on the starter battery if I were to have the roof lights on for say a couple of hours or so?

I get that this may seem really simple, but I am not good with electric circuits, much better with mechanical things, or a hammer!

Chris, it sounds like the way your lights are currently wired are as I've added here on my previous diagram. They are probably just using the supply side of the van lights, which disappears after a while as you have discovered and being switched to earth. If you can reconfigure your switch and wiring as per my previous diagram then that should give you what you want. The quiescent current of the relay board is only 2.3mA, which will mean a neglible drain on your van battery, (i.e it would take 5 years to flatten a 100Ah battery). When the lights are on, however, assuming they are 3 watt LEDs then they will take 1.5A on total, so a couple of hours would be 3Ah, a small proportion of your van's battery capacity. However if you left them on for 24 hours that would be 36Ah, a pretty significant proportion of the battery capacity.
Hope that helps!

 

[Mccoatup]

Hi, I've been looking again at this and again thanks for the time in preparing the diagram.

I've been trying to plan this and have a couple of questions. I cant make diagrams as good as yours.

1. My dimmer switch has an on/off function as well as dimming. Its has 2 inputs and 2 outputs, the dimmer in your diagram has only 3 connections. How would I wire this? Is it possible to use this as the switch, S1 and the dimmer or do I need a separate switch S1?

View attachment 55121

2. I have completely removed the ceiling courtesy light fittings, so in the section:

View attachment 55122
Can the connection you have to the red / brown wire be move to before the filament lamp to the red / black as its basically just wire between them (although with a bit of resistance)? (ie line A)

3. Where does To Power Control Unit (B) connect to?

Thanks again for any help.

I can't tell from looking on eBay adverts whether the -ve sides of the dimmer are common, but I would expect them to be, in which case they just both connect to earth. I can't see how you could use the dimmer as the switch to switch the relay as it stands. If you could dig inside the dimmer unit and find a switched +ve supply line then you could do it. I might well order one and have a play!
With regard to the red/brown wire connection, no, you need both of these kept separate. There is 12v across them at times - the 'just wire' (which is the bulb) between them is effectively around 50 ohms which limits the current 0.25A or so. If you short them out you are likley to blow a van fuse.
The arrow going to the Power Control Unit is just part of the exisiting van wiring. I may be wrong but I think it goes back into the Control Unit not just to courtesy light and door switches, based on the behaviour of the voltage levels I have seen on it. (i.e it sits at around 3 volts at some times).

 

[Skyliner33]

I can't tell from looking on eBay adverts whether the -ve sides of the dimmer are common, but I would expect them to be, in which case they just both connect to earth. I can't see how you could use the dimmer as the switch to switch the relay as it stands. If you could dig inside the dimmer unit and find a switched +ve supply line then you could do it. I might well order one and have a play!
With regard to the red/brown wire connection, no, you need both of these kept separate. There is 12v across them at times - the 'just wire' (which is the bulb) between them is effectively around 50 ohms which limits the current 0.25A or so. If you short them out you are likley to blow a van fuse.
The arrow going to the Power Control Unit is just part of the exisiting van wiring. I may be wrong but I think it goes back into the Control Unit not just to courtesy light and door switches, based on the behaviour of the voltage levels I have seen on it. (i.e it sits at around 3 volts at some times).

Thanks, as for the dimmer I have I am pretty sure it dims on the -ve side as the +ve to +ve is < 1 Ohm.

Regarding the red / brown connection could I just use a resistor (I have some 1k to hand)

If its getting complicated with regards the dimmer, I might order one of the ones you linked, and the relay module (pity I cant just order 1 lol).

 

[Mccoatup]

I see you can order an identical relay board from eBay at £3.40 each. (5V or 12V 1-2-4-8 Channel Relay High Low Level Optocoupler Module for Arduino PI) but make sure you specifiy the 2 channel 12v version.
If its common +ve then just connect the 2 positives of the dimmer together to the +12v supply and use the Ov connections in and out of the dimmer.
Regarding the red/brown connection, you do still need to connect across both sides of the existing courtesy light bulb (Red/Brown and Black/Red). I can't see how a resistor would help with this.

 

[Skyliner33]

I see you can order an identical relay board from eBay at £3.40 each. (5V or 12V 1-2-4-8 Channel Relay High Low Level Optocoupler Module for Arduino PI) but make sure you specifiy the 2 channel 12v version.
If its common +ve then just connect the 2 positives of the dimmer together to the +12v supply and use the Ov connections in and out of the dimmer.
Regarding the red/brown connection, you do still need to connect across both sides of the existing courtesy light bulb (Red/Brown and Black/Red). I can't see how a resistor would help with this.

Thanks again. My relay board has arrived.
If you could help clarify a couple of points.
Firstly the correct setting of the jumpers S1 and S2. Should they both be set to high, os S1 to hight and S2 to low as in the pic of your circuit?

Secondly regarding the dimmer, I connect the 0V in terminal to ground and the 0V out terminal to COM2 on the relay board?

Lastly regarding the OEM courtesy light unit I dont really want to have to install it above my ply ceiling as the filament lamp would be on and I wouldn't be able to tell. Also if the bulb blew I would have a really difficult job getting to it. The idea of a resistor was to use instead of the resistance of the filament bulb to eradicate these problems. ie I would connect BLK/RED wire to RED/BROWN with the correct value resistor and then the connections from the NC terminals would tap into the equivalent places on your diagram.

Thanks again.

 

[Mccoatup]

Yes the jumpers are both set to the same position so that the relays operate when the voltage at IN1 and IN2 rises from 0v to +12v. I think the jumper positions shown on the diagram are correct (yellow jumpers nearest the edge of the circuit board).
And yes, regarding the dimmer, connect the 0V in terminal to ground and the 0V out terminal to COM2 on the relay board. I have updated the circuit diagram to show this better.
And regarding the filament bulb, if if I understand you correctly, you shouldn't need to add a resistor at all. As long as there is one courtesy light operating in the van (such as the one above the dashboard) then you should just need to make the connections to the wiring as shown.

 

[Skyliner33]

Yes the jumpers are both set to the same position so that the relays operate when the voltage at IN1 and IN2 rises from 0v to +12v. I think the jumper positions shown on the diagram are correct (yellow jumpers nearest the edge of the circuit board).
And yes, regarding the dimmer, connect the 0V in terminal to ground and the 0V out terminal to COM2 on the relay board. I have updated the circuit diagram to show this better.
And regarding the filament bulb, if if I understand you correctly, you shouldn't need to add a resistor at all. As long as there is one courtesy light operating in the van (such as the one above the dashboard) then you should just need to make the connections to the wiring as shown.

Thanks for the clarifications. My problem is that all the bulbs in the unit near the rear view mirror are LED not filament. Will it still work? That’s why I’d rather use the wiring in the rear so asking about the resistor trick.

 

[Mccoatup]

As far as I am aware, all the courtesy lights, front and back, are on the same circuit. The voltage seen across the actual bulbs, whether they are LED or incandescent, will still be 12v. This is because an LED bulb is made up of a number of LEDs with some form of current limiting included (probably just a resistor), so that you can apply 12v directly across them without blowing them up. So it should all work without that resistor. Sometimes resistors are added across LEDs whetehy replace incandescent bulbs sothat they take a similar current, otherwise the vn might show a fualt thinking there's a bulb blown, or in the case of old style indicator flashers they can flash far too quickly.
nyway, from where you are now, the quickest thing is probably just to try it out!

 

[Skyliner33]

As far as I am aware, all the courtesy lights, front and back, are on the same circuit. The voltage seen across the actual bulbs, whether they are LED or incandescent, will still be 12v. This is because an LED bulb is made up of a number of LEDs with some form of current limiting included (probably just a resistor), so that you can apply 12v directly across them without blowing them up. So it should all work without that resistor. Sometimes resistors are added across LEDs whetehy replace incandescent bulbs sothat they take a similar current, otherwise the vn might show a fualt thinking there's a bulb blown, or in the case of old style indicator flashers they can flash far too quickly.
nyway, from where you are now, the quickest thing is probably just to try it out!

Thanks, when I get time and the weather improves a bit I will start with an install off the circuit and report back my findings.