Upsizing Tyres things to know

[Skyliner33]

Yes Paul, this is how I (we - my mate) understand it, hence why I wanted it changed. More so for the Speedo but it does affect other parameters although TBF not by a massive amount. (Someone I’m sure will work it out) but we are talking a gradual discrepancy over the lifetime of the van.



He’s based in Andover, Hampshire. I’m seeing him later this week so I’ll ask for some more details regards Operating System’Program required blah blah. (it’s equivalent to Main Dealer I do know that much). Re: a charge, I’m sure he’d do it for very little. (And he’s an VW nut!!) After all it’s such a quick job. If I get details I’ll post as any Service Outlet with the right program (main dealer, diagnostic specialist etc) should be able to access it. I’ll also ask him if he knows if VCDS had the capability to change it too. (It’s not like he’s managed to crack the enigma code or anything like that, or he’s being secretive, it’s just he knows his way round the systems).

The main reason he first looked for me, when I chatted about the issues people were having with VCDS and changing the wheel variant only to find they couldn’t change it back, (which he was aware of as it alters the main ‘operating system’ if you like, (best analogy I can give) was he knows it’s common practice on the continent (in some countries) to change the wheels and sizes for harsh winter conditions then change back in the summer (Thinking France, Switzerland etc) so he said ‘you must be able to alter it like for like, I’ll just have to find it’. Hey presto, 5 minutes later he’s got it.

Will post with update in due course.

Cheers.

Thank you very much for the input.

I found this on the RossTech forums about park steer assist, so suggests the menu might be visible to vcds.

Parking assist module coding

Hi all im trying to code a new/used parking assist module. How do i code this in also which coding would i need. Any help would be great many thanks This scan is for the old module Wednesday,04,November,2020,19:01:00:41193 VCDS -- Windows Based VAG/VAS Emulator Running on Windows 10 x64 VCDS...

forums.ross-tech.com

Maybe one of the more savvy members could help? @mmi @Robert @Pauly @dnoermann ?

 

[Kind of Blue]

This one allows you to compare sizes:

Tire Size Comparison

Tire size comparison the easy way. Use our tire size comparison calculator to compare diameter, width, sidewall, circumference and revolutions per mile.

tiresize.com

That is a comparator that I refer to also very useful. It ha all sorts of comparisons including tyre pressures. Changing tyre sizes and constructions may or may not change the tyre or (tire) pressures that one may need to change to when making a change in tyre or wheel. Many who have made changes may possibly not be aware and could possibly have incorrect pressures for any new set up.

Incorrect pressures can be detrimental to handling, braking, tyre life and comfort. Too hard and traction will not be optional could cause premature skidding poor baking and discomfort. Too soft and handling could be sloppy, imprecise, cause tyre ware and overheating of the tyre which it may not recover from. It is also a legal requirement to have correct pressures. If one is unfortunate enough to have an accident which may have killed or injured someone, the police may check tyre pressures among other things and results could very seriously prejudice your case in a defence and any legal action. So generally we should be attentive to tyre pressures in any case regardless.

Changing a wheel size if using appropriate tyres may not change overall circumference and therefore diameter. A larger wheel may still fit under the wheel well. If changing a wheel size to a larger type to maintain overall circumference and diameter usually the tyre side wall is reduced. This usually results in a harsher ride, the larger the diam of wheel the less side wall and ultimately the ride becomes unpleasant it may also affect handling at extreme ends. Many change wheel size for appearance only there may be consequences to this at extreme ends is that really what one wants perhaps a compromise or moderation might be better. After all who are we trying to impress, our selves or others and then how often are we sat just looking at them, when driving we only have a fleeting distorted view from a side mirror. Obviously, I have little understanding of social pressures.

For the best experience we would always have the most suitable tyre for the roads and conditions that we drive in. That could mean possessing several types of wheel tyre combinations at our disposal, winter, summer off road and so on. Where we live and what we regularly drive on may dictate some direction or another but for most compromises are the order of the day. I have several set of wheels and tyres and have sheds to put them in but it is still a pain changing over and for many they have nowhere to store them. Some may have an absolute necessity to have off road biased tyres. Perhaps they live on a farm or small holding and may even live completely off road as I do or perhaps have to tow cattle trailers across muddy fields and track ways/ Al these people may need something like All Terrain tyres or even Mud Terrain. Some people may visit fields for camping and so on perhaps an All Season tyre may do the job. there may be or is a trade off with tyres and tyres more suited to Off Road use may be or are a compromise when travelling on ordinary roads and motorways. Fortunately there are many manufacturers and many types some more extreme and definitely directed at more off road use. The BF Goodridge AT KO tyre are defiantly one of the best and toughest All Terrain tyres available anywhere and come in a huge range of sizes but is it really the best choice for suburban life. BF Goodridge do make off road tyres that are less extreme. The same is also true of other off road tyre manufacturers that make All Terrain Tyres they may make a range of tyres that may suitable and may still posses that "look" if that is the important consideration. The other thing is many of these AT tyres may be coming in XL but also have very high load ratings on top of just the XL.

 

[Swamperise]

If you’re an ‘idiot’ on wet roundabouts it will understeer like a pig on the AT tyres, but it’s a van!! So handling wise no worries. Nice and comfy. No excessive roll other than what you’d get anyway and lowering slightly with updated springs in future will help.

As you say "it's a van" so I don't mind the agricultural aspect of the handling. If I wanted sporty handling I would have bought a sports car not try an make a van be sporty, anyway helps keep you on the right side of the law too. I was also going to lift it with a 35mm Bilstein/Eibach setup, apparently even lifted it handles better than stock due to the better spec'd dampers and springs, we will see.

I’m going to lob a suitable steely up there to cover any (hopefully never) puncture.

You're right though, I expect putting a big ass wheel on the tailgate is going to make opening the tailgate a workout unless I upgrade the gas struts, maybe I'll rethink that option, otherwise the other half will moan at me about not being able to open the tailgate.

Have you thought of getting a spacesaver for the underslung wheel holder for those emergency moments. I've just looked and there are a few spacesavers from Range Rovers on Ebay that would fit the bill, i.e. they have an equivalent rolling radius to match the swamper tyre dimensions, but are fitted to a narrow steel wheel so would hopefully fit in the underslung wheel holder.

 

[Swamperise]

Where we live and what we regularly drive on may dictate some direction or another but for most compromises are the order of the day.

I agree an "aesthetic" can override what is most suitable or sensible, but sometimes the compromise you talk about is accepting the handling limitations that the "aesthetic" bestows. I understand not everybody likes the "Swamper" aesthetic, and some of my choices are arguably overkill, but I do want the van to have a greater off-road ability than OEM due to where I drive it.

I (personally) think that a van's handling characteristics already align better with the "hardy/swamper" aesthetic" in contrast to the "sporty/dynamic" aesthetic in that an improvement to its off-road ability will only be slightly detrimental compared to its original OEM characteristics. Whereas trying to make a van into a sportier handling vehicle is never really going to achieve that goal, it might look sportier, but its OEM handling characteristics where never intended to be "sporty", they were always intended to be robust, reliable and practical which is what a swamper style vehicle is. Anyway I'm clearly biased

 

[mmi]

Thank you very much for the input.

I found this on the RossTech forums about park steer assist, so suggests the menu might be visible to vcds.

Parking assist module coding

Hi all im trying to code a new/used parking assist module. How do i code this in also which coding would i need. Any help would be great many thanks This scan is for the old module Wednesday,04,November,2020,19:01:00:41193 VCDS -- Windows Based VAG/VAS Emulator Running on Windows 10 x64 VCDS...

forums.ross-tech.com

Maybe one of the more savvy members could help? @mmi @Robert @Pauly @dnoermann ?

Yes, VCDS has the access. Even the vans without the actual assisted steering functionaly for automated parking.

 

[Vinyl1210]

Yes, VCDS has the access. Even the vans without the actual assisted steering functionaly for automated parking.

Ok. As promised caught up with my mate as promised. He said from recollection (which backs up comment above) that he thinks you can access it, but his view was it wasn’t as perhaps as straightforward as using the OEM approved full diagnostic software. As above make sure you alter ‘actual size’ in Park Steer Assist.

He advises any ‘Bosch Car Service Centre’ or Main Dealer, or good independent with full diagnostic OEM compatible software should be able to do this in a few minutes.

I’m sure the guys who are VCDS savvy will post in due course. Hopefully the above has helped people on the right track and identified the correct sub menu to go into.

 

[Kind of Blue]

I agree an "aesthetic" can override what is most suitable or sensible, but sometimes the compromise you talk about is accepting the handling limitations that the "aesthetic" bestows. I understand not everybody likes the "Swamper" aesthetic, and some of my choices are arguably overkill, but I do want the van to have a greater off-road ability than OEM due to where I drive it.

I (personally) think that a van's handling characteristics already align better with the "hardy/swamper" aesthetic" in contrast to the "sporty/dynamic" aesthetic in that an improvement to its off-road ability will only be slightly detrimental compared to its original OEM characteristics. Whereas trying to make a van into a sportier handling vehicle is never really going to achieve that goal, it might look sportier, but its OEM handling characteristics where never intended to be "sporty", they were always intended to be robust, reliable and practical which is what a swamper style vehicle is. Anyway I'm clearly biased

I am neither for or against aesthetic creation it is mainly beyond me, its a vehicle that serves a porting function that can serve other functions, that is more or less it. I realise that many regularly spend entire weekends washing polishing their steed but it would be pointless here Though I would say I am concerned by fashions that could be dangerous, ultimately tyres that might be, over stretched over rims that do no qualify legally, that is being beyond the legal recommended width for tyres being used or not having the slightest concern fore the safety and well being of other such as fitting poor lighting mods or tyres that rub on body or project beyond body that sort of thing. So far as Swamper I just think that it needs to be pointed out that more suitable tyres would be a better bet for the majority of people Off Road biased tyres will not perform as well in most on road situation by comparison they use more fuel because they are far heavier by far due to the construction tread and belting are often labelled XL with high load rates so are stiffer and ride harder and most start off noisier as new than other tyres but all develop far more noise as the off road tyres wear. AT tyre price will rise thefts and so on. that might be of concern to people who have genuine need and requirement for that sort of tyre. Most of these manufacturers make alternative less or slightly less of road biased that might be a better more sensible bet. If people want to paint their T puke pink that is up to them but someone may point out some detraction or other. The same applies to dropped vehicles if that may or may not contribute to problems with tyres or handling, Overly large rims, elastic band tyres, etc, etc and so on but most of all safety and that applies especially toward innocent third parties. Ultimately if accidents were on the rise due to particular trends then governments start to twitch and may legislate I guess though insurance companies tend to act sooner.

T vehicles, the T6 I am familiar with can be driven or set up to do many things it is versatile, particularly in 4Motion form whether that be sporty or off road and can easily be tailored with little effort for either or both. In fact they are very capable off road, the ramp over geometry is probably the main limiting factor followed by departure and then approach in that order and of course, wad-ability. Which is a concern because of the situation and positioning of the air intake and also low freeboard in-between the wheelbase which would tend towards far too easy easy floatation which is not very desirable. Kept inside its limits or modified with thought and sensibility the T6 performs very well off road mine, has the rear differential lock which is very useful. I would much prefer Ferguson/Quafe Limited geared limited slip differentials which perform far better in most situations allowing use through turns, full differential locks are brutal and not sympathetic on bendy sections which can cause transmission damage or not allow tight tuns and need to be turned off in some situations because of wind up. That may require reversing in order to completely disengage and then proceeding again with with less traction. The Ferguson / Quaffe allows full differential action but still controls slippage. Mine lives off road just requiring shopping necessitate off road driving. The ground now is exsteamly saturated and any none stony route difficult even with diff locks oversized All terain BF Goodridege tyres. To have proceeded wouldhave necessitated deflation to very low levels and get very wet and torne up the goound. The other way was two parralel rivers very fast flowing not deep but frack damaging in that large stones where being torn out and moved smaller stones deposited hundreds of metres away rut becoming deeper and deeper.

 

[Skyliner33]

Yes, VCDS has the access. Even the vans without the actual assisted steering functionaly for automated parking.

I found the Park assist module in vcds for my van, even though it does not have it, there are a few other things in that module is does have. However my knowledge/skill with vcds is not good enough to find the settings I need to adjust.

 

[Skyliner33]

Ok. As promised caught up with my mate as promised. He said from recollection (which backs up comment above) that he thinks you can access it, but his view was it wasn’t as perhaps as straightforward as using the OEM approved full diagnostic software. As above make sure you alter ‘actual size’ in Park Steer Assist.

He advises any ‘Bosch Car Service Centre’ or Main Dealer, or good independent with full diagnostic OEM compatible software should be able to do this in a few minutes.

I’m sure the guys who are VCDS savvy will post in due course. Hopefully the above has helped people on the right track and identified the correct sub menu to go into.

Thanks again, as above I can find module Park steer assist, but Im not knowledgeable enough to find the settings I need to change.

 

[mmi]

I found the Park assist module in vcds for my van, even though it does not have it, there are a few other things in that module is does have. However my knowledge/skill with vcds is not good enough to find the settings I need to adjust.

Yes, it's the controller 10 - Park/Steer Assist- which handles also parking sensors. The setting is under "Adaptation", IDE00845-Wheel circumference.

Interestingly it's set to 2150 mm on all VCDS full scans of T6.1 I have got this far - both 17" and 16" chassis. Even more interesting is that not all T6.1 have the controller 10 to tweak.

 

[Skyliner33]

Yes, it's the controller 10 - Park/Steer Assist- which handles also parking sensors. The setting is under "Adaptation", IDE00845-Wheel circumference.

Interestingly it's set to 2150 mm on all VCDS full scans of T6.1 I have got this far - both 17" and 16" chassis. Even more interesting is that not all T6.1 have the controller 10 to tweak.

Thanks.I will have a look. I think I already sent you my scan.

 

[mmi]

I think I already sent you my scan.

Yes, I do have the files - thank you!
If you adjust the Wheel circumference value in controller-10 , could you please, after the change, make blockmap recordings of

(1) Controller-10-Park/Steer Assist and​

(2) Controller-17-Instruments.​

Just curious to see how the change propagates into 17-Instruments.

 

[Skyliner33]

Yes, I do - thank you!
If you adjust the Wheel circumference value in controller-10 , could you please, after the change, make blockmap recordings of

(1) Controller-10-Park/Steer Assist and​

(2) Controller-17-Instruments.​

Just curious to see how the change propagates into 17-Instruments.

Thanks. I can confirm that it is there and that my van came with 16" Clayton wheels and is set at 2150mm.

I haven't changed it yet (not decided what I want it set to.) In case it cant go back.