Based on the above I have a startline Kombi with Buisness pack will that still only have the 140A Alternator? At what Rate would you charge the ecflow 2 at ?
Ecoflow Alternator Charger 800W
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Based on the above I have a startline Kombi with Buisness pack will that still only have the 140A Alternator? At what Rate would you charge the ecflow 2 at ?
As a rule of thumb assume 80% efficiency and aim to use a third of the peak alternator power.
So you want to draw about 50A from the alternator, with 80% that would be 50 x 0.8 on the other side of the charger so 40A
If the settings are in amps you're done, if watts then 40 x 12 = 480W
As always that's a guideline, you can probably afford more in the summer when things are electrically easier, and I'd start lower if you do a lot of short journeys.
Other thing to keep in mind is keep an eye on your normal charge time - it's kinder to everything to charge a bit slower so if you can recharge your usual consumption in your usual journey time at a slightly lower rate that will be better - you can always bump the rate up if you are going camping for the week.
Thanks for the above
My daily commute to work is 20miles so that should be ok. I'm tempted to upgrade the alternator but looks like a pig of a job.
Lastly anyone got a video of how to route the cable through to the battery ?
How long will it take to charge from empty at 500w? Sorry about the questions but I'm.totally useless when it comes to electrics
Depends what size of pack you are charging.
I'd advise not running them totally flat, every charge cycle puts some wear on the cells so it's more like driving an engine than filling a fuel tank. Try not to drop below 20% in general use, occasionally doesn't matter and usually helps the battery meters calibrate.
You should have a rating on the pack in either Wh (watt hours) or Ah (amp hours) for capacity. So just divide the watt hours by 500 or the amp hours by 40 and that should give you the rough time taken. In reality it will be a bit longer as charge rates slow down as the battery is nearly full.
I'd advise not running them totally flat, every charge cycle puts some wear on the cells so it's more like driving an engine than filling a fuel tank. Try not to drop below 20% in general use, occasionally doesn't matter and usually helps the battery meters calibrate.
You should have a rating on the pack in either Wh (watt hours) or Ah (amp hours) for capacity. So just divide the watt hours by 500 or the amp hours by 40 and that should give you the rough time taken. In reality it will be a bit longer as charge rates slow down as the battery is nearly full.
LITTLELEITO69
New Member
Hi, can you please take some pics that can help me wire the cables from the battery to the cabin? can't find any path yet
tammo
New Member
Here's a link to a leisure battery installation video which shows the routing of the cable:
jaydisc
New Member
I have had an Alternator Charger and Delta 2 installed in my T6.1 California since September, and it's truly been an awesome experience. I hooked it up to the factory leisure battery under the passenger seat, and occasionally do reverse charging, and everything works wonderfully.
However, I've only had it temporarily wired in, and now want to make something permanent of it. Here is the current path from the passenger leisure to the right side of the boot (around the bench seat):
As this is a factory-built camper, I'm not familiar with what entry and exist points I can use to accomplish this (with preferably no, or very little drilling please). Can anyone please give me some pointers in the right direction? I presume I can exit out from underneath the passenger seat (vs out the middle of it, as is currently), and somehow route that cable to the back of the boot, here (where the Delta and Alternator Charger currently are). I'd like to the Delta to continue to live where it is, but I'd like to mount the Alternator Charger (which is currently on the floor between the Delta and rear bench seat) on that side, angled wall behind the bench seat, and under the window.
Can I route the cable underneath the seat rail system? Are there any other recommended paths? Can anyone suggest a video/thread where someone routed cabling along a comparable/similar path?
Thank you.
However, I've only had it temporarily wired in, and now want to make something permanent of it. Here is the current path from the passenger leisure to the right side of the boot (around the bench seat):
As this is a factory-built camper, I'm not familiar with what entry and exist points I can use to accomplish this (with preferably no, or very little drilling please). Can anyone please give me some pointers in the right direction? I presume I can exit out from underneath the passenger seat (vs out the middle of it, as is currently), and somehow route that cable to the back of the boot, here (where the Delta and Alternator Charger currently are). I'd like to the Delta to continue to live where it is, but I'd like to mount the Alternator Charger (which is currently on the floor between the Delta and rear bench seat) on that side, angled wall behind the bench seat, and under the window.
Can I route the cable underneath the seat rail system? Are there any other recommended paths? Can anyone suggest a video/thread where someone routed cabling along a comparable/similar path?
Thank you.
JmStockholm
New Member
I have a California T6.1 Ocean and often camp in cold weather away from power hookups. My main requirement is to have powwr to run the diesel heater, as it’s the primary device drawing current more or less constantly. I’m looking at setting up an EcoFlow Delta 2 as my main power source, complemented by the EcoFlow Alternator Charger.
The idea is to have the EcoFlow Delta 2 primarily manage charging, discharging, and supplying power to house battery consumers, including the diesel heater. The AGM batteries in the van would act as a backup, stepping in only when the EcoFlow runs out of power thereby saving their lifespan by limitung the occasions I run them down to 20%.
Could someone help me figure out the best way to install and configure this system to achieve my goal?
The idea is to have the EcoFlow Delta 2 primarily manage charging, discharging, and supplying power to house battery consumers, including the diesel heater. The AGM batteries in the van would act as a backup, stepping in only when the EcoFlow runs out of power thereby saving their lifespan by limitung the occasions I run them down to 20%.
Could someone help me figure out the best way to install and configure this system to achieve my goal?
Your challenge here will be your existing AGM leisure battery systems is "always on" - whereas pretty much any power bank system installed in a vehicle is going to eventually power save and turn itself off due to their often surprisingly high idle loads of all the management electronics. They also have very temporary style connections in general, less ideal than hardwired terminals.
You would get much better functionality with less intrusive wiring and space used by simply moving to a lithium leisure system. That's a bit more involved in the Ocean (2 locations and shunts to manage things via the camper control panel), but my guess would a lot less involved than trying to intercept all that and somehow stick a portable power pack in the middle.
A much less intrusive solution might be to add a good charging socket to your existing leisure system - the Anderson SB50 is popular - and then use the power bank to charger the leisure every now and then to extend the run time.
And never ever run an AGM down to 20% - you may as well just hit them with hammer for what it will do to their lifespan - 50% is the level to aim for (and why the Ocean has 2)
JmStockholm
New Member
Yes, I see the point. Need to investigate the threads regarding a AGM to LiFePo4 swop. If anybody can point me in the right direction to find info about doing this in a Cali Ocean T6.1 I would be grateful!
tammo
New Member
Hi. Apologies for the 6milllion naive questions i'm about to ask! Would you mind elaborating a little bit more on this setup as it's exactly what i'm after (or photos of how you've wired the alternator charger cable to the leisure battery)? From what I understand you have a factory fitted leisure battery which is under your front passenger seat with it's corresponding charging management system. Have you then literally just connected the Ecoflow alternator charger cable straight to the leisure battery's pos + neg terminals? Are you getting the 800W charging rate on the Delta 2 even when daisy-chained to the whole leisure battery setup? When you reverse charge, you are able to top up the leisure battery from the Delta 2? Engine running or off? I'm no electronics expert by any means but am amazed that it all works without any conflict with the existing leisure power/charging management setup. Thanks in advance!
jaydisc
New Member
Would love to. Yes, the EF AC cable attaches to the Leisure battery's positive, but the negative has to connect to chassis/ground, because the Leisure battery has a shunt on its negative terminal that you want everything to go through to preserve the functionality of the battery monitoring system in the overhead display.
FWIW, the EF AC instruction manual endorses both the connecting of the Alt Charger's negative to chassis/ground (vs battery negative terminal) as well as using the Leisure battery (vs. Starter battery), so this is a fully supported setup.
Yes! I contacted my VW dealer to ask about my California's alternator size/spec, and was told, "it's a smart alternator, which can peak at 250A". However, I have reduced the wattage to 500W on the Alternator Charger by default, as 500W for AC input is the recommended amount to preserve long-term battery life on the Delta. I am also conscious about the fact my California is my daily drive and most days it's just short trips, so the Alt. Charger is always on, topping my batteries. This makes me worry my alternator is always working hard on every short trip. Regardless, I know if I _need_ to top-up, and fast, it's trivial to change it in the app temporarily.
So, when the car thinks the Leisure battery is at 80%, it reduces the alternator voltage, expecting the car's braking surplus to further charge the Starter/Leisure the remaining 20%. This is a relatively known behaviour about the T6.1 (and T6?) Californias and their Split Charge Relay. Anywho, the T6.1's have a Max Charge button on the overhead display, which basically just shoots the alternator output voltage back up to ~14.5, and the Leisure battery, AND the EF Alternator Charger kick back in to do their job. So, if the smart alternator management isn't what you want (although 90% of the time, it is!), the Max Charge button basically tells everything to properly charge until full!
Yes! And, if the Leisure is low enough, it also accepts 800W of reverse charge speed! The car's engine is off, and it, and the Starter Battery are completely uninvolved.
I also am no expert, but did a lot of research, and not only were a few people doing it, seeing it as a described configuration in the Alternator Charger's manual really cemented it for me. I don't really understand how the Leisure Battery and Alternator Charger negotiate which takes how much Voltage/Amperage coming from the alternator, but the Leisure always reduces its input as necessary, and seemingly, the Alt. Charger does the same, and presumably because it's further down the chain, the Leisure has precedence? Which is fine? This is the area of theory I don't fully understand yet, but for 5 months, it's been working amazingly.
tammo
New Member
@jaydisc Thanks for taking the time to explain everything so thoroughly. This is definitely a very interesting setup, even though it still amazes me that it maintains all it's functionality correctly without clashing with the existing leisure battery setup! I read the Ecoflow alternator charger manual and indeed it mentions hooking up to the 'RV house battery' as an option:
Note: it mentions to connect the EFAC negative terminal directly to the negative house battery terminal. You mentioned that you didn't. Thoughts?
Thanks again!
Note: it mentions to connect the EFAC negative terminal directly to the negative house battery terminal. You mentioned that you didn't. Thoughts?
Thanks again!
jaydisc
New Member
My pleasure. Yes, the "Safety Instructions" included with my Alt. Charger closely mimic the manual you've linked to. I'm not sure why they suggest connecting to the negative terminal "if you are connecting to an RV", but the fact that they say you can ground the negative terminal "to the chassis" was an acceptable endorsement for me. I watched a couple YouTube videos where both reviewers said the Alt. Charger worked fine connected to terminal and/or chassis. But it's really all about shunts (battery meters) in my experience.
I have a California Beach, which only has one leisure battery (under the passenger seat), and attached to its negative terminal, is the factory shunt that enables the van's display to show the battery's state of charge and V/A in/out. If you bypass that, and connect directly to the negative terminal (as I once did with a Victron wall charger), the van's display, and thus, the van's brain, gets out of sync with the actual state of the battery. In my case, the Victron charger had fully charged the leisure battery, but the shunt wasn't seeing the flow - it was only observing power out, and eventually, the van shut down all access to the leisure battery with the message, "Battery empty. Charge immediately", even though the Leisure was completely full! The solution was to temporarily disconnect and reconnect the cable that connects the display to the shunt, which reset the van's awareness of the leisure battery's actual state of charge. I then properly connected the negative of the Victron charger to the chassis (one of the seat's bolts), and from then on, the display properly shows any charge coming in via the Victron, and the van and battery haven't been out of sync since. Luckily, that learning took place before I set up the Alternator Charger, but have no doubt, if you connect the Alternator Charger directly to a the negative terminal of a battery with a shunt, that shunt will have no awareness, and if other systems react based on the state of that shunt, you can get into similar trouble.
Can you tell us a bit more about your setup? Is this a California or T6/6.1 w/a factory leisure battery setup? Is there a shunt/meter/display?
I have a California Beach, which only has one leisure battery (under the passenger seat), and attached to its negative terminal, is the factory shunt that enables the van's display to show the battery's state of charge and V/A in/out. If you bypass that, and connect directly to the negative terminal (as I once did with a Victron wall charger), the van's display, and thus, the van's brain, gets out of sync with the actual state of the battery. In my case, the Victron charger had fully charged the leisure battery, but the shunt wasn't seeing the flow - it was only observing power out, and eventually, the van shut down all access to the leisure battery with the message, "Battery empty. Charge immediately", even though the Leisure was completely full! The solution was to temporarily disconnect and reconnect the cable that connects the display to the shunt, which reset the van's awareness of the leisure battery's actual state of charge. I then properly connected the negative of the Victron charger to the chassis (one of the seat's bolts), and from then on, the display properly shows any charge coming in via the Victron, and the van and battery haven't been out of sync since. Luckily, that learning took place before I set up the Alternator Charger, but have no doubt, if you connect the Alternator Charger directly to a the negative terminal of a battery with a shunt, that shunt will have no awareness, and if other systems react based on the state of that shunt, you can get into similar trouble.
Can you tell us a bit more about your setup? Is this a California or T6/6.1 w/a factory leisure battery setup? Is there a shunt/meter/display?
tammo
New Member
Thanks @jaydisc for your explanations and examples of the results of grounding to the chassis. Very useful.
My needs are to keep the whole setup modular as at times I need to remove the bed system to fit the rear bench back and use it to ferry relatives around when they visit...or lose all the rear seats and fill it to the brim with my work equipment. The Van-King bed system can be taken out with one tool in minutes.
I'm now about to get a leisure battery system fitted which, to be honest, is to mainly power the diesel heater that is also going to be fitted. I'm after a very straight forward discreet and tidy battery setup as I don't have great power needs; 5v and 12v outputs as a priority but no real need for AC power. The idea is to fit a 100AH AGM battery under the driver's seat (I have a LHD) with a DC to DC charger and output to a very neat snap-fitting Powerboxx unit under the front passenger seat:
The Powerboxx gives me some 5v and 12v outputs as well as a leisure battery voltage readout. The 220v AC outputs only work when you hook up to shore power but that's not an issue for me. Additionally, when connected to shore the Powerboxx acts as a leisure battery charger if required. I may decide to replicate the Powerboxx setup with something more custom and bespoke but in essence that's what i'm after. I have no need to distribute power to any other point in the van from this source.
What I will add to all this is an EcoFlow Delta 2 and the EF 800W Alternator charger. For one, I need it for when I have my van in work mode to charge batteries and operate power tools both in and out of the van. But also secondly, to power a Dometic CFX3 25 fridge when i'm in leisure mode. I'm not sure the 100AH leisure battery is going to give me the capacity to run the fridge too long during the warmer months here in Spain so that's where the Delta 2 would step in. It will also allow me to reverse charge the leisure battery if required.
The game changer for me is the EcoFlow Alternator Charger. The fast charging potential makes me think that I could nearly forget about lugging solar panels around.
Anyway, this still remains a work in progress but seeing how you've successfully plumbed your EF alternator into your leisure setup has really inspired me!
I'm pretty much starting with a blank canvas. I've got a LHD 2024 VW T6.1 Caravelle (aka Shuttle in the UK) without a leisure battery setup or any portable power. It has a 2,2+1,3 seat arrangement but i've removed the rear 3 seat bench to accommodate the brilliant Van-King bed and steel slider system:
My needs are to keep the whole setup modular as at times I need to remove the bed system to fit the rear bench back and use it to ferry relatives around when they visit...or lose all the rear seats and fill it to the brim with my work equipment. The Van-King bed system can be taken out with one tool in minutes.
I'm now about to get a leisure battery system fitted which, to be honest, is to mainly power the diesel heater that is also going to be fitted. I'm after a very straight forward discreet and tidy battery setup as I don't have great power needs; 5v and 12v outputs as a priority but no real need for AC power. The idea is to fit a 100AH AGM battery under the driver's seat (I have a LHD) with a DC to DC charger and output to a very neat snap-fitting Powerboxx unit under the front passenger seat:
The Powerboxx gives me some 5v and 12v outputs as well as a leisure battery voltage readout. The 220v AC outputs only work when you hook up to shore power but that's not an issue for me. Additionally, when connected to shore the Powerboxx acts as a leisure battery charger if required. I may decide to replicate the Powerboxx setup with something more custom and bespoke but in essence that's what i'm after. I have no need to distribute power to any other point in the van from this source.
What I will add to all this is an EcoFlow Delta 2 and the EF 800W Alternator charger. For one, I need it for when I have my van in work mode to charge batteries and operate power tools both in and out of the van. But also secondly, to power a Dometic CFX3 25 fridge when i'm in leisure mode. I'm not sure the 100AH leisure battery is going to give me the capacity to run the fridge too long during the warmer months here in Spain so that's where the Delta 2 would step in. It will also allow me to reverse charge the leisure battery if required.
The game changer for me is the EcoFlow Alternator Charger. The fast charging potential makes me think that I could nearly forget about lugging solar panels around.
Anyway, this still remains a work in progress but seeing how you've successfully plumbed your EF alternator into your leisure setup has really inspired me!
I would just advise that if you are fitting new don't fit AGM - a LiFePo based setup is superior in nearly every way and the initial cost difference is now minimal - the long term cost it will be cheaper as a LiFePo should last up to 10 years, whereas the lifetime of an AGM if worked hard (and leisure systems do) can be as low as 2 years.
Don't plan to fit an old technology system and then "fix" it by adding a more complex portable LiFePo - which is where you seem to be heading - get the installed system right first and use the portable system for what it is best at, being portable.
tammo
New Member
Thank you @roadtripper . You're absolutely right. I will go down that road. The priority is to get the installed system done well. The EcoFlow is a bonus...an interesting bonus. Cheers
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