Roamer 160S under single swivel seat

[IestynD]

Part 1 of possibly 2

I wanted to start this thread... I've be speaking with Chris at Roamer about the 160S. I couldn't fit a seatbase battery as I have an inverter and a fuse box in the seat base. I still wanted more than 100Ah of power though. Roamers 160S is the exact same dimensions as their 100S, it obviously costs 50% more but you are getting over 50% more power so for £900 I thought I'd give it a go.

It arrived next day delivery!

First problem actual physical fit under the seat... I have to lay it on its side which isn't a problem at all - Roamer assure me the LiPo4 cells don't mind which way up they are. In order to get it to sit low enough I am going to have to angle grind the ridge off the seat base, and some of the brackets.... The ridge is the one in the middle of the seat base, that the standard AGM style battery would tuck up against - Pictures to follow.

This means I'm going to have to rethink the current mess...

This is my current seat base:



The blue box is a small inverter for charging laptops or running a projector.
In the right hand corner there is a Victron smart shunt - Now surplus to requirements as the Roamer battery has built in BMS so i will look to sell this or maybe just shunt it onto something else.....

All of the blocks on the bracket to be cut off, will need to be removed (Green, Blue, Brown, and Black and purple)..... luckily they are able to be re-homed into the free spare slots on the front - I didn't have to push them under the floor as I really didn't want to do that.





I still want to be able to charge the new battery from the pig tail/fly lead type connection I pulled through the bulk head into the battery bay under the bonnet - My Victron IP66 charger is brilliant it has a LiPo4 charge profile so I may want the option of charing without having to remove the passenger seat.

I am going to fit an Victron MPPT 75/15 under the drivers seat along with the Tri smart B2B charger. There is a 180W solar panel going on the roof. That combined with the 160Ah lithium should mean I never need to hook up! I need to try and fit the invertor under the passenger seat next to the battery as the 3 pin plug cut out is already in place!

I'll get the base modified and the battery strapped in and then i will update with a picture and some more detail. All new leads to be made up due to relocation of terminals etc - I love that time in the garage with the heat shrink tube - you always feel like your doing a proper job when your doing that.

More pictures to follow....

 

[IestynD]

Part 2 - There will be more!

So I set about the seat base with an angle grinder, a hammer and a metal file/rasp.

This is the result - It doesn't look like much has changed but the 160S now lays completely flat under the seat, which will enable me to put either a bar across to keep it in place or probably some cab buckle straps - maybe even both!
The plugs have all been rehoused to the new location in the front pannel which has allowed me to do away with the plastic housing at the side.




Everywhere the angle grinder touched needed filling with the metal file in order to make it smooth and less sharp!

I gave it a quick light spray with some paint i had knocking around... its not perfect but it takes the initial obvious shinny fresh cut metal look away!

I have a question if anyone is able to offer some advise - I have a large fuse located on the size of the seat base... The is in between the main starter battery and the leisure battery. I think it is actually wired like this for now:

Starter battery ------> Old T5.1 style relay ----------> BIG fuse ------------> leisure battery.

DellMassive reminded me about mixing rules... The Van is going to have some work done to it on the 22nd November. Its having a new Victron Orion TR smart DC to DC charger fitted.

SO I think it will be wired like this:
Starter battery -------> Orion Tr Smart DC-DC -------> BIG Fuse ---------->leisure battery.

The Orion DC-DC can have a charge profile for LifPo4 batteries that will be used.

All of the things i attach to the leisure battery are fused individually - eg the diesel heater, the LED lights and the USB/12V sockets...

I am going to re fit the inverter and I guess that should be fused? Its a 300W inverter (can be seen in the pictures further up this thread) nothing too fancy to be honest but its small and works for laptops etc..
Do i need any other fuses in between anything you can think of?

Thanks for looking so far... I will post some more pictures when I can get back out and get it finished up. I think another hour should see it all done.

 

[IestynD]

Saving a space for the next and hopefully final update on the Roamer 160S battery fitting.

Update

So, I've finally got around to getting the 160S under the single passenger swivel.

Its a bit mental under there! Not as pretty as I would have hoped for but its all in and working. I now have 160Amp hours of Lithium battery I can use. Its all hooked up to a Victron MPPT solar controller with a 180W panel on the new storm pop top, and a Victron TriSmart B2B charger.





I had to strap it down as the original brackets wouldn't work with the larger battery. I managed to keep my small inverter in place.
A funny thing keeps happening, my diesel heater (Webasto) will not work unless it is directly connected to the battery.... even if it goes via a distribution box it won't work! No idea why!

Anyways its all in and working. It can be done! A Roamer160S under a single swivel seat!

Any questions please don't be shy - happy to share the knowledge.

 

[Dellmassive]

I'm not sure about this.....

Starter battery ------> Old T5.1 style relay ----------> BIG fuse ------------> leisure battery.

You shouldn't mix lithium and AGM chemistry battery's via a relay. (Lithium rest voltage is higher so will back feed to starter.

And lithium can burn out the alternator or cabling as there is no current limiting from the engine bay.)

You need to swap out the relay for a decent dc-dc charger....

Imho you don't want to connect a lithium battery direct to an alternator.

I'll copy in @RoamerBatteries for confirmation.

See here for more info on dc-DC chargers ....

[Guide] DC-DC Charger (for leisure battery) -- How I Done It --

DC-DC Charger (for Leisure battery) -- How I Done It -- ************************************************** Dellmassive`s -- "how I Done It" -- Thread ************************************************** Kit List And Stuff -- How I Done It & What I Use --...

www.t6forum.com

.

 

[IestynD]

I'm not sure about this.....



You shouldn't mix lithium and AGM chemistry battery's via a relay. (Lithium rest voltage is higher so will back feed to starter.

And lithium can burn out the alternator or cabling as there is no current limiting from the engine bay.)

You need to swap out the relay for a decent dc-dc charger....

Imho you don't want to connect a lithium battery direct to an alternator.

I'll copy in @RoamerBatteries for confirmation.

See here for more info on dc-DC chargers ....

[Guide] DC-DC Charger (for leisure battery) -- How I Done It --

DC-DC Charger (for Leisure battery) -- How I Done It -- ************************************************** Dellmassive`s -- "how I Done It" -- Thread ************************************************** Kit List And Stuff -- How I Done It & What I Use --...

www.t6forum.com

.

Hi mate,

Sorry I know this - From you in other posts on this forum
I forgot to mention that I am fitting a Victron Orion Tr Smart DC-DC charger. Thats going under the drivers seat and the main battery will connect to that and then in turn that will connect to the Leisure battery. I am also fitting a 180W solar on the roof and connecting that to the VIctron MPPT charge controller also under the drivers seat- I love Victron stuff!

Thanks for the reminder though.

 

[Linoleum Bonypart]

Daft question what’s under the other seat

 

[IestynD]

Daft question what’s under the other seat

Not a daft question at all... It currently has an empty seat base safe - which just has the duct from the diesel heater passing through it and terminated into the face plate/door.

Towards the end of November my vans getting a pop top fitted and some more electrical work from a fitter so they will fit the B2B charger and the MPPT - they will replace the seat base with a standard one and fit the duct through it and finish it nicely. As well as installing the B2B and MPPT.

Thanks

 

[Linoleum Bonypart]

I’m all Victron and Roamer have you thought about swivel seats ..??

 

[IestynD]

I’m all Victron and Roamer have you thought about swivel seats ..??

Both seats are swivel seats....

 

[IestynD]

So, I've finally got around to getting the 160S under the single passenger swivel.

Info added to post three




Any questions please don't be shy - happy to share the knowledge.

 

[tlnds]

@lestynD do you think a 160S would fit any better under a single seat base without a swivel base? Due to be doing this but not sure if I'll need to 'edit' the seat base at all

 

[IestynD]

Hi @Tinds - I don't think it would... I think the swivel seat gives it a smidge more height. I'll double check when my Mrs gets back with my an later tonight and get some better pictures so you can see.

Standby for an update a bit later.

Thanks

 

[IestynD]

@tlnds I'm really sorry for the poor response... I've just remembered about this.

The swivel seats do give a smidge more height BUT that height isn't needed. The battery laid on its side is just lower than the regular seat base. (assume mine is a regular seat base with a swivel bracket fitted to it).

Hope thats some use.

 

[tlnds]

Thanks @lestynD, that's helpful. managed to get it installed nicely under the seat now

 

[Green Giant]

Ahh found the perfect thread
Hi, just been looking at your photos of the 160 install, as this is something I’m hoping to do.
Im at the stage of working out what components, (mainly Victron) can fit under passenger seat alongside the Roamer 160, iv also got the factory wiring. Loom connectors fitted underneath seat.
I see you have your small inverter in there, is there much room for any more kit or is it pretty much full?
What is the plastic box on the rear of your seatbase with the 3 holes in top?
My diesel heater is fitted inside the drivers seat swivel, ( to keep it dry if wading through rivers etc) I’m hoping to fit a 1000w inverter alongside this, so not much room left underneath for other components, hence trying to work out how much can fit under the passenger seat, without removing the factory wiring loom bits, although iv been told it is possible to tuck some of this under the cab rubber mat,
(Sorry due to my work can only reply after 8pm)
ps, how are you finding the 160 battery in use, Plenty of juice?
Cheers

 

[IestynD]

I really rate the Roamer. 160 is plenty. We have a solar panel on the roof and we now don't bother with hook up. We can be self sufficient for weeks at a time. We have a fridge plugged in 24x7, we use a diesel heater a night (a lot my Mrs likes it toasty). We charge phones and have lights on all the time..
The inverter is probably the weakest link in the entire set up. I'm VERY limited with space under the passenger seat so I'm not really in a position to upgrade it to anything bigger. It works to charge things like laptops, walkie talkie type radios but it doesn't see a lot of use. Most things we have are USB or 12v so all really easy to just plug in chargers all over.

Its pretty full under both seats now - The B2B and MPPT(all Victron) is brilliant, but BIG... So they are under the drivers seat with the ducting for the diesel heater coming up through there as well.

The plastic box you talk about (with the 3 holes) is the front of the seat base, it has a 3 pin plug outlet mounted in it, looks a bit like this one:

 

[roadtripper]

@Green Giant Keep in mind the just coming to market new Victron DC-DC charger is a lot smaller and potentially lower heat, which may help with space usage.

Also have a good think if you need the 1000w inverter as they take up a good chunk of space, generate heat and consume battery capacity - many folks find that they can be self sufficient on 12v/USB off grid and you'll have mains available on EHU days.

 

[Green Giant]

Fantastic, really helpful info, thank you, I see the seat base section now, a useful nook to fit a socket of some kind.
I looked at the R230 seatbase, but space is an issue for us because our diesel heater is internal.
The 100a batteries probably would get us by, but we are building and planning to use the van in winter, uk and Europe, etc, so the 160a has that extra capacity to make sure the diesel heater has enough power to heat the van interior so we don’t get any issues charging the battery when it’s well below 0.
I feel a plan is now finally coming together

 

[Green Giant]

@Green Giant Keep in mind the just coming to market new Victron DC-DC charger is a lot smaller and potentially lower heat, which may help with space usage.

Also have a good think if you need the 1000w inverter as they take up a good chunk of space, generate heat and consume battery capacity - many folks find that they can be self sufficient on 12v/USB off grid and you'll have mains available on EHU days.

Cheers, I’ll look out for that new one, I take on board your comment, re inverter, agree it’s a bit of a luxury, the main usage was to power a small slow cooker 100w and also our Hot Chocolate velvetiser machine at 450-500w (3 minutes)
At the moment we use the ecoflow power pack, so potentially we could just carry on using that when needed if we aren’t on EHU, thinking about it , on a long trip away I think I would take the ecoflow anyway, just for emergencies.. I always pack too much!

 

[roadtripper]

Cheers, I’ll look out for that new one, I take on board your comment, re inverter, agree it’s a bit of a luxury, the main usage was to power a small slow cooker 100w and also our Hot Chocolate velvetiser machine at 450-500w (3 minutes)
At the moment we use the ecoflow power pack, so potentially we could just carry on using that when needed if we aren’t on EHU, thinking about it , on a long trip away I think I would take the ecoflow anyway, just for emergencies.. I always pack too much!

That's a good plan with the Ecoflow as you can top it up on EHU. You might also be able to add an charge point for it to your 12v system, have a look at Dellmassive's threads on getting the best charge in to them via the solar input this way.

If you are expecting winter use, especially on the continent, then make sure you get a battery that is self heating. Lithium will discharge happily when below freezing but will be permanently damaged if charged below freezing.