Low temperature lithium battery

[Mick]

So I just went to my van for a quick play!

Set the solar to 14v and we'll see how it goes tomorrow battery is sitting at 13.4v 86%.

Set the Poweroad to sleep mode - eek! The Voltmeter on the van (see vid) and on the BMV went crazy and the SOC on the BMV App went to just a line with no percentage at all and wouldn't come back.

Vid: IMG_6122.MOV

I could not manually set the SOC in the BMV from the SOC showing from the battery app (86%) So I synchronised it to 100% in the BMV battery setting and the set it manually to 86% which is what the battery app % was showing. That worked

Conclusion: If you put your Poweroad to sleep then your BMV and Van Voltmeter will have a fit

 

[Dellmassive]

So I just went to my van for a quick play!

Set the solar to 14v and we'll see how it goes tomorrow battery is sitting at 13.4v 86%.

Set the Poweroad to sleep mode - eek! The Voltmeter on the van (see vid) and on the BMV went crazy and the SOC on the BMV App went to just a line with no percentage at all and wouldn't come back.

Vid: IMG_6122.MOV

I could not manually set the SOC in the BMV from the SOC showing from the battery app (86%) So I synchronised it to 100% in the BMV battery setting and the set it manually to 86% which is what the battery app % was showing. That worked

Conclusion: If you put your Poweroad to sleep then your BMV and Van Voltmeter will have a fit

well . . . on that front your findings are correct.

when you put the battery into SLEEP mode it disconnects the internal battery from the terminals.

Not exactly true as you can meter out a 5v (very low current) monitoring voltage, as seem here:

battery sleeping, and voltmeter reading 4.5v across terminals.



...


so for you . . . putting the battery in sleep mode will shut off the power to the BMV712 and other kit. . . .

that will most likly wipe the history memory . . .

++++


you might be able to reconfigure your BMV712 install to the twin battery monitor so it reads the starter battery too . . . . (if you are not using the Temp probe)

that might keep the BMV powered while the Leisure is SLEEP mode - ie switched off.


...


EDIT:

The purpose of the battery SLEEP mode is just for long term storage . . . . to stop any parasitic power draws from draining the battery too low.


so it will be best to set your charging sources and leave the SLEEP mode alone. (its basically a soft ISOLATOR ON/OFF switch)

.

 

[Mick]

well . . . on that front your findings are correct.

when you put the battery into SLEEP mode it disconnects the internal battery from the terminals.

Not exactly true as you can meter out a 5v (very low current) monitoring voltage, as seem here:

battery sleeping, and voltmeter reading 4.5v across terminals.

View attachment 118455

...


so for you . . . putting the battery in sleep mode will shut off the power to the BMV712 and other kit. . . .

that will most likly wipe the history memory . . .

++++


you might be able to reconfigure your BMV712 install to the twin battery monitor so it reads the starter battery too . . . . (if you are not using the Temp probe)

that might keep the BMV powered while the Leisure is SLEEP mode - ie switched off.


...


EDIT:

The purpose of the battery SLEEP mode is just for long term storage . . . . to stop any parasitic power draws from draining the battery too low.


so it will be best to set your charging sources and leave the SLEEP mode alone. (its basically a soft ISOLATOR ON/OFF switch)

.

The BMV is connected to the main battery As well. The real answer is turn down the Solar absorption voltage and leave the sleep function alone.

 

[Dellmassive]

Yes agreed . . .

Spec states 14.4v charge source. (14.4v / 4 = 3.6v per cell bank)

so you could try reducing the charge source by 0.2v untill you stop getting "high cell alerts"

eg

14.4 / 4 = 3.6v per cell bank

14.2 / 4 = 3.55v per cell bank

14.0 / 4 = 3.5v per cell bank

13.8 / 4 = 3.45v per cell bank

13.6 / 4 = 3.4v per cell bank


then just keep the SLEEP mode for long term disconnection.

note that its recommended to run Lithium cells at 50% SOC for storage.


so for long term storage, drop the battery to 50% SOC, then sleep mode.



I've not seen self discharge figures list anywhere.

 

[Dellmassive]

User Guide / manual

 

[Dellmassive]

manufacture:

12V LINC INFI Low Temperature Lithium Battery

We're known as one of the most professional 12v linc infi low temperature lithium battery manufacturers and suppliers. Welcome to buy or wholesale customized 12v linc infi low temperature lithium battery from our factory. All custom made products are with high quality and competitive price.

www.poweroad.com

escription
The LINC INFI Low Temperature Lithium Battery is specially designed with heating function that can be charged at temperature down to -20°C. The process of heating and charging is automatically controlled by the BMS embedded in the battery. The operation of our low temperature battery is exactly the same as our other Lithium-ion batteries.

It takes about 40 minutes to heat from -20°C to +5°C. Once the battery temperature reaches +5°C, the charging starts immediately. And when the temperature rises to +10°C, the heating stops while charging continues, which means our LINC INFI Low Temperature Lithium Battery is the ideal battery for cold weather.

Besides, the LINC INFI Low Temperature Lithium Battery presents the same quality, performance and dimensions with our 12V LINC INFI LiFePO4 Rechargeable Battery. Direct replacement is possible.

Key Features
● Can be charged at temperature down to -20°C for cold weather use
● Same quality, performance and dimensions as other Lithium batteries for direct drop-in replacement
● 12V to 48V flexible battery system of boosted capacity for powering various applications
● The battery status like SOC, SOH and more can be monitored via APP
● 150A high output current for driving high-power devices
● Detachable upper cover and replaceable BMS design can reduce the cost of maintenance
● Embedded BMS can prolong battery life and guarantee battery safety
● Sleep mode for reducing energy consumption and prolonging the shelf life
● Dual terminal design for easier installation and better heat dissipation
● IP54 protection level for ensuring battery remains unaffected by water under specified conditions
● Compact size ensures easy installation even in limited space

Performance Characteristic

Specifications

Electric	Nominal Voltage	12.8V
Nominal Capacity	100Ah
Stored Energy	1280Wh
Internal Resistance	≤10mΩ
Cycle Life	＞2000 (1C@100%DOD)
Charge	Charge Voltage	14.4V
Charge Mode	CCCV (Continuous Current, Continuous Voltage)
Standard Charge Current	20A
Max. Continuous Charge Current	60A
Discharge	Discharge Cut-off Voltage	10V
Standard Discharge Current	20A
Max. Continuous Discharge Current	150A
Peak Discharge Current	350A (＜5S)
Environment	Charge Temperature Range	-20°C ~ +45°C
Discharge Temperature Range	-20°C~ +55°C
IP Protection Level	IP54
Mechanical	Weight	13kg±0.5kg
Dimensions (L×W×H)	330mm×170mm×190mm
Terminal	M8
BCI Group	31

FAQ
Q1: How long will it take to charge battery at low temperature?
A: Normally speaking, it will vary due to the environment temperature and the charging current. If the temperature is as low as -20°C, the charging time should be a little longer, which means you need to plus about 40 minutes heating time.

Q2: Does the LINC INFI Low Temperature Lithium Battery have the Bluetooth function? Can I also use the Bluetooth connection to check the battery status?
A: Yes. Our LINC INFI Low Temperature Lithium Battery also features the Bluetooth function. Just the same as our 12V LINC INFI LiFePO4 Rechargeable Battery. The APP is available and can be downloaded both in the Android and IOS system now.

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[Mick]

Yes agreed . . .

Spec states 14.4v charge source. (14.4v / 4 = 3.6v per cell bank)

so you could try reducing the charge source by 0.2v untill you stop getting "high cell alerts"

eg

14.4 / 4 = 3.6v per cell bank

14.2 / 4 = 3.55v per cell bank

14.0 / 4 = 3.5v per cell bank

13.8 / 4 = 3.45v per cell bank

13.6 / 4 = 3.4v per cell bank


then just keep the SLEEP mode for long term disconnection.

note that its recommended to run Lithium cells at 50% SOC for storage.


so for long term storage, drop the battery to 50% SOC, then sleep mode.



I've not seen self discharge figures list anywhere.

I'll be all over this today. I'll stick my e Bike battery on charge using the inverter which'll pull 15-16A then try this above method of reduction but as we can see from the attached it is alarming at 3.35v. The float voltage is at 13.5 so I may go straight to that at 3.37v & see how low that is.

Dropbox - File Deleted - Simplify your life

www.dropbox.com

 

[Dellmassive]

Just for reference....

This is battery 1 (94)....
After been sitting at rest for 24hrs.

 

[Dellmassive]

And same for battery 2 (95)

..

 

[Mick]

So Im down to 61% using the inverter on my bike battery but the BMV 712 stayed at 100% no idea why! I've manually reset its and it seems to be following the Poweroad BMS app.

Found a Victron video which lets you save and name a preset so I ahve a preset call parked at 13.2v absorption and float at 13.1. That has turned of the solar charging. Now I'll just monitor it.

 

[Mick]

So Im down to 61% using the inverter on my bike battery but the BMV 712 stayed at 100% no idea why! I've manually reset its and it seems to be following the Poweroad BMS app.

Found a Victron video which lets you save and name a preset so I ahve a preset call parked at 13.2v absorption and float at 13.1. That has turned of the solar charging. Now I'll just monitor it.

Pretty sure I’ve now cracked this. I’ve done the following:

1. On my Victron MPPT 75/15 solar controller created a user preset called Parked.
2. Set absorption to 13.2v - float to 13.1.
3. Battery stays at 62% with the voltage at 13.27 so above absorption & float. If it drops to 59% 13.17v it starts to trickle charges. Any load on the battery then the solar starts to put some current in.
4. when I’m on site I turn it to my LifePo4 preset which is pre configured and that should be it

 

[Dellmassive]

Suns out - Solar time =]

heres the latest two Lensun Flaxable panels, 100w each so 200W max.



id say 80% Sun availability.



those are connected to a Victron MPPT 100/30 in parallel.



MPPT settings are LifPo4 defaults:

14.2v Bulk/Absorb
13.5 Float
5DegC temp cutoff
30A max charge rate

+++



battery is @ 58% at the start..



+++

Victron APP readouts . . . . .

90W ish
6.2A charge rate



.


TBC

..

 

[Mick]

I’ve just been out to the van. Everything was off. Heart drop moment
BMV showing nothing.
The POWEROAD didn’t connect to the Bluetooth. Eek!

switched it on 78% 13.2v & had gone into sleep mode. The BMV had to be ready synced to 100% and manually adjusted to 78%.

Conclusion is when it goes into sleep mode because no current is going in or out it completely disconnects. Which is a good thing. But I did have a fright

 

[Dellmassive]

On mine, i noticed it took about 24hrs to enter semi-sleep.... (blue level nights off)

But turning on a load or switching on the charger bought it back awake.

So i think it a low power mode and not the manual full sleep...

 

[Dellmassive]

here is an example:

battery on RHS has put itself into low power mode . . (blue lights off) with out me pressing the SLEEP button.

this was after about 24hrs of doing nothing..




i plugged in the ECOFLOW 12v charge lead . . . to the RHS battery.




straight away it pops back into life . . . . #






so normal operation by the looks of things.

im seeing about 8.0v at the terminals when in low power mode.

 

[Dellmassive]

I’ve just been out to the van. Everything was off. Heart drop moment
BMV showing nothing.
The POWEROAD didn’t connect to the Bluetooth. Eek!

switched it on 78% 13.2v & had gone into sleep mode. The BMV had to be ready synced to 100% and manually adjusted to 78%.

Conclusion is when it goes into sleep mode because no current is going in or out it completely disconnects. Which is a good thing. But I did have a fright

@Mick

re:

The BMV had to be ready synced to 100% and manually adjusted to 78%.

there is a setting on the BMV that you need to change.


its the setting that defaults the SOC to 100% after a power cycle - turn it to "OFF".

that way it will restart with the last known value. ( ie 78% in your case)

if your BMV reset to 100% that indicates this setting is set ON.

see here:

 

[Dellmassive]

NEW 2021 - RENOGY Release LifePO4 with built in heater

but the charge specs dont show SUBZERO . . . . . but do go down to0degc - unless thats a typo.

Lithium LifePo4 12v Batteries - Time For An Upgrade?

I've got a factory fitted leisure battery under the factory swivel base so the base seat battery looks really good as an upgrade, but is it as simple as just swapping them, and do I need to worry about leaving permanently in the van? I've got a factory fitted leisure battery under the factory...

www.t6forum.com

 

[BigDean]

I’ve just been out to the van. Everything was off. Heart drop moment
BMV showing nothing.
The POWEROAD didn’t connect to the Bluetooth. Eek!

switched it on 78% 13.2v & had gone into sleep mode. The BMV had to be ready synced to 100% and manually adjusted to 78%.

Conclusion is when it goes into sleep mode because no current is going in or out it completely disconnects. Which is a good thing. But I did have a fright

So does this mean that if you have it hooked up to a CerboGX/VRM setup, you will not be recording the data?

thanks.

 

[Dellmassive]

So does this mean that if you have it hooked up to a CerboGX/VRM setup, you will not be recording the data?

thanks.

Ill hook one up and test that......

 

[Mick]

@Mick

re:




there is a setting on the BMV that you need to change.


its the setting that defaults the SOC to 100% after a power cycle - turn it to "OFF".

that way it will restart with the last known value. ( ie 78% in your case)

if your BMV reset to 100% that indicates this setting is set ON.

see here:

View attachment 119299View attachment 119300View attachment 119301

I did put a load on by switching on the lights etc. It never came to life but the sleep button pressed worked well.

@Mick

re:




there is a setting on the BMV that you need to change.


its the setting that defaults the SOC to 100% after a power cycle - turn it to "OFF".

that way it will restart with the last known value. ( ie 78% in your case)

if your BMV reset to 100% that indicates this setting is set ON.

see here:

View attachment 119299View attachment 119300View attachment 119301

Lee it was off.