Newbie battery charger questions
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Something happened mid-morning on the 11th. Are you sure you didin't leave a light on? Door left open?
That's a pretty quick drop - remind me what you've got physically connected to the battery currently?
I guess the other thing is to look for correlation around the times this happens; same time of day, same time since charged, same weather (is something getting wet in the rain and mildly shorting)?
I guess the other thing is to look for correlation around the times this happens; same time of day, same time since charged, same weather (is something getting wet in the rain and mildly shorting)?
Thanks for responding again @roadtripper.
Van has lights and dimmer, dometic crx50 fridge, usb sockets, battery status panel, dometic hob, water pump for taps. Oh and the heater but the fuse has been pulled on that for months.
Weather has been rainy for months (we live in Wales) and not decernably different at the times the discharge began. Have checked for any signs of dampness and none found, though of course much of the area with wiring is inaccessible.
1st time it happened was after just shy of 6 days and second time was just 1 day 9 hours so no correlation there. Times are different too.
Only thing different was that van had been left on hookup for 2 weeks before the first time. So battery was on charge for much longer than any time previously. I don't think any overcharging or battery damage should be possible with the Victron ip22?
I have now pulled all the fuses (except the charger) and will see what happens after the next charge. How long do I need to charge for to fully charge before next test (and is there any way to know from the victron app?).
Van has lights and dimmer, dometic crx50 fridge, usb sockets, battery status panel, dometic hob, water pump for taps. Oh and the heater but the fuse has been pulled on that for months.
Weather has been rainy for months (we live in Wales) and not decernably different at the times the discharge began. Have checked for any signs of dampness and none found, though of course much of the area with wiring is inaccessible.
1st time it happened was after just shy of 6 days and second time was just 1 day 9 hours so no correlation there. Times are different too.
Only thing different was that van had been left on hookup for 2 weeks before the first time. So battery was on charge for much longer than any time previously. I don't think any overcharging or battery damage should be possible with the Victron ip22?
I have now pulled all the fuses (except the charger) and will see what happens after the next charge. How long do I need to charge for to fully charge before next test (and is there any way to know from the victron app?).
Once a battery is charged on a modern multi stage charger it should drop into its final maintenance stage - doesn't matter at that point how long you leave it connected the battery is full and that level of charge should have no detrimental effects on the battery, it's just gently charged to counteract the natural discharge. So in your earlier screenshots the float stage represents fully charged and then if you leave it connected it drops back to a lower storage stage.
If there was an issue with the battery itself I would expect the discharge to be predictable, and it doesn't seem to be.
It's more likely to be an external factor.
How old is your leisure battery?
If there was an issue with the battery itself I would expect the discharge to be predictable, and it doesn't seem to be.
It's more likely to be an external factor.
How old is your leisure battery?
Just over a year old but before we knew that it was discharging so quickly, it likely wasn't well looked after.
If the voltage is recovering then I'd agree that looks very like a load that causes the voltage sag and the recovery afterwards.
Maybe let it run for a bit.
Then ideally charge it and disconnect the charger... it would be nice to rule out the charger doing something daft if it's now the only thing connected.
Maybe let it run for a bit.
Then ideally charge it and disconnect the charger... it would be nice to rule out the charger doing something daft if it's now the only thing connected.
So I let it continue overnight and basically it flat lined.
It's now back on charge and I will pull the charger fuse afterwards as you suggest and monitor again.
I think there is one other item which isn't via the fuse banks - the ctek d250se. In theory, if it isn't the victron then it's this (or the battery)?
Quite honestly I was at the point where I was willing to accept that we hadn't looked after the battery and would have to replace it but these symptoms don't seem to fit that being the problem.
It's now back on charge and I will pull the charger fuse afterwards as you suggest and monitor again.
I think there is one other item which isn't via the fuse banks - the ctek d250se. In theory, if it isn't the victron then it's this (or the battery)?
Quite honestly I was at the point where I was willing to accept that we hadn't looked after the battery and would have to replace it but these symptoms don't seem to fit that being the problem.
This bit of your chart, is this the van just sat on the drive, with nothing charging it? You don't have solar, right?
It shouldn't be fluctuating like that if there's no draw or charge, it should be a nice steady line with a gradual decline, like mine:
Yours looks like something is pulling a semi decent draw, which is never allowing the battery voltage to settle down, and then at a certain point it's cutting off (probably due to low voltage) which is when you're setting the drop off a cliff.
It still makes no sense though, as if there was a draw, this lowers the voltage you see, but yours goes up at times, almost like you have solar feeding a tiny charge.
Edit: actually, that wavey bit is at well over 13v, so something MUST be charging it during this. I presume the higher peaks are when you're driving?
It shouldn't be fluctuating like that if there's no draw or charge, it should be a nice steady line with a gradual decline, like mine:
Yours looks like something is pulling a semi decent draw, which is never allowing the battery voltage to settle down, and then at a certain point it's cutting off (probably due to low voltage) which is when you're setting the drop off a cliff.
It still makes no sense though, as if there was a draw, this lowers the voltage you see, but yours goes up at times, almost like you have solar feeding a tiny charge.
Edit: actually, that wavey bit is at well over 13v, so something MUST be charging it during this. I presume the higher peaks are when you're driving?
Yes I have no solar and all the charging (including your circled timeframe) is from hookup. Each time I have tested its been by charging then removing the charge and watching what happens. I don't think the van has been started in the time frame of that graph. It's tended (as with this time) to start off with a typical discharge, slow reduction in the voltage and then dropping off a cliff and then sitting at the low level.
You make an interesting observation about the lack of straight lines which could mean something pulling power even while it's charging but I don't know what.
You make an interesting observation about the lack of straight lines which could mean something pulling power even while it's charging but I don't know what.
Ahh yes of course it's your leisure battery that's having the issue. I only have a BM2 on my starter battery, on my leisure battery I have a Renogy shunt so I can see precisely the draw on the battery.
This is mine at the moment with everything off (all my stuff - fridge, tap, usb ports, lights) is switched apart from the diesel heater. As you can, basically zero draw (0.01a charge).
When you tested with just the CTEK fuse in, was the battery still connected to everything else (just no fuses in)?
I'd suggest disconnecting the battery from everything completely (apart from the BM2) then charging with the Victron to full, then removing the Victron then letting it sit for a day or 2. At least then you can rule out any dodgy wiring causing a draw from somewhere. You'll also know if the battery is knackered and you're trying to track down a draw when it's actually the battery that's the issue.
Basically, eliminate all variables and possibilities so you can test one thing at a time.
I'd say this isn't even normal
That's dropping from (roughly) 12.6/12.7v to about 12.4/12.3v in 14hrs. That's not right. Especially on a leisure battery which should have nothing drawing on it, as it's not activated when you lock or unlock the van. My starter battery might drop 0.1v over 24rs and that's if I've been opening the (electric) sliding doors a lot. My LB literally looses nothing over days.
Hmm I think this may provide useful information.
So I dared to leave it without charging and... It went back above 12v for a time yesterday evening before dropping off a cliff back down then slowly continuing down. The van hasn't been touched in that time, not charged nor started. I'm confused.
Now wondering whether to leave it longer or recharge before possibly doing the disconnection of the battery terminal suggested.
So I dared to leave it without charging and... It went back above 12v for a time yesterday evening before dropping off a cliff back down then slowly continuing down. The van hasn't been touched in that time, not charged nor started. I'm confused.
Now wondering whether to leave it longer or recharge before possibly doing the disconnection of the battery terminal suggested.
That's making my brain hurt.
Even more confusing, it's only getting to about 12.4v before dropping off a cliff to 11.6v. 12.4v is about 75% SOC.
It looks very much like something drawing power intermittently.
Ultimately, if you test to see if the battery is holding charge with absolutely nothing connected (which I think you'll find it is) then at least you've eliminated that as a possible issue. It does mean that you're faced with the task of trying to track down a wiring fault or faulty device.
How is everything attached to your battery, can you remove things one by one or is it all attached as one? Also, you said you removed all fuses and it was still happening - where is the fuse box in relay to the battery?
Everything goes through the fuse banks except the heater (fuse removed already), the ctek d250se and the victron ip22.
I'm thinking that pulling the fuse between the ctek d250se and the leisure battery might be worth doing before disconnecting the battery. Is there any risk in doing this?
I'm just thinking that this is the only thing apart from the victron charger that is connected to the battery without going through the fuse banks.
I'm thinking that pulling the fuse between the ctek d250se and the leisure battery might be worth doing before disconnecting the battery. Is there any risk in doing this?
I'm just thinking that this is the only thing apart from the victron charger that is connected to the battery without going through the fuse banks.
Nope, that'll only be used when charging from the alternator which you're not doing if you're driving it.
Just a thought - does the CTEK have a function to trickle charge the starter battery?
Edit: it does.
I wonder if this is the source of your draw? With the LB fully charged via the Victron, it's then pulling from the LB to feed the SB. Either working as intended (ha!) or, more likely, faulty.
I searched my d250se manual for that but couldn't find it but I then googled it and found the reference. Hence, I'm not sure if the model I have does this or not.
One thing confuses me, you say there is no point pulling the fuse between the d250se and the LB. Surely though if the d250se can redirect maintenance charge to the starter battery then it must go through this fuse (in reverse)?
One thing confuses me, you say there is no point pulling the fuse between the d250se and the LB. Surely though if the d250se can redirect maintenance charge to the starter battery then it must go through this fuse (in reverse)?
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