Hillside Birchover

[Captain Quick]

View attachment 199381
Had a look behind the secret door earlier to have a look at the current mains charger.

Any idea what the two loose cables could be? Perhaps spare connections for optional extras I don’t have?

Incidentally whilst on the topic of this cupboard, I was quite disappointed to find out the hot water cylinder on mine is mains power only. Seen various forum posts and videos where owners of older Birchovers have been able to heat on 12V also whilst travelling to site or driving around. I guess it won’t be that big an issue though

That's interesting Sarah. The charger appears to be a 16Amp switch-mode CBE CB-516 model. The user manual says it's suitable for lead/acid and gel type batteries and doesn't mention AGM batteries which is slightly concerning if Hillside are still fitting this charger to latest T6.1s with factory supplied AGM auxiliary batteries. I saw on the CBE website that this model has now been superceded by a CB-516-3 model which has a third charge mode specifically for AGM batteries. Just out of interest, is your leisure battery an AGM type?

BTW, I can't work out the purpose of the two unconnected tails behind the panel.

 

[EAN]

I can’t believe I’m reading a thread where people have brand new custom vans “in -build” from a well known converter, and before the van is actually built they’re researching how to make it work properly. Is it me??

They build well to a specific “standard”, rather than custom: It’s how they have whole vehicle type approval and are also VW approved.
I’m sure they could be more flexible, but they are a business that doesn’t want or need to, as they see it, take risks.
No different to people swapping suspension, wheels etc. from original; happy with the vehicle but want to make “improvements” to suit how they use it or want it to perform “better”.

 

[Salty Spuds]

They build well to a specific “standard”, rather than custom: It’s how they have whole vehicle type approval and are also VW approved.
I’m sure they could be more flexible, but they are a business that doesn’t want or need to, as they see it, take risks.
No different to people swapping suspension, wheels etc. from original; happy with the vehicle but want to make “improvements” to suit how they use it or want it to perform “better”.

Presumably you’re paying a premium for all the type approvals. Once you start “improving” items that are part of the type approval, does this negate the approval?
Re. Improvements. On a Eu6 engine, I’d consider a B2B charger a necessity, not an improvement. Even VW offer this now with the factory 2nd battery, although at an eye watering price.
I just can’t get away from the case that Birchover are charging for bits of paper, which a cynical Yorkshire man might consider as clever marketing, when the money could be put to better use.
We looked at Birchover when we were researching our van purchase, so we are familiar with them.

 

[EAN]

@Salty Spuds I’m not sure there’s much of a premium or any for the Type Approvals in reality.
When I was researching and deciding whether to buy “off the shelf” or get a van and then get it converted, I found Hillside‘s offering to be pretty competitive even factoring in that I would change things later to suit how I use the vehicle.
The bits of paper give a level of assurance that the vehicle is safely built to an agreed consistent standard.
It’s a method of recording confidence in the manufacturer.
Yes “improving” items will negate the Type Approval and also invalidate parts of the Warranty just as doing any changes to a base vehicle might. Of course the conversion itself that Hillside do to the base van is approved by VW, so unlikely to be problematic.
Many Eu6 vehicles manage fine without a B2B charger: Depends totally on end use.
I want the option to go offgrid for longer periods, without solar; to do that I require a decent sized lithium which dictates that I require a B2B to get a lithium charge profile. If I was alway on EHU, it really wouldn't matter.

 

[Captain Quick]

@Salty Spuds I’m not sure there’s much of a premium or any for the Type Approvals in reality.
When I was researching and deciding whether to buy “off the shelf” or get a van and then get it converted, I found Hillside‘s offering to be pretty competitive even factoring in that I would change things later to suit how I use the vehicle.
The bits of paper give a level of assurance that the vehicle is safely built to an agreed consistent standard.
It’s a method of recording confidence in the manufacturer.
Yes “improving” items will negate the Type Approval and also invalidate parts of the Warranty just as doing any changes to a base vehicle might. Of course the conversion itself that Hillside do to the base van is approved by VW, so unlikely to be problematic.
Many Eu6 vehicles manage fine without a B2B charger: Depends totally on end use.
I want the option to go offgrid for longer periods, without solar; to do that I require a decent sized lithium which dictates that I require a B2B to get a lithium charge profile. If I was alway on EHU, it really wouldn't matter.

I agree EAN. It’s the principal reason I chose a Hillside over other converters including VW. If I was paying someone else to do the conversion, then I certainly didn’t want a horrorshow from a bunch of backstreet cowboys. I’m married to a cynical Yorkshirewoman and she could understand the value of that even though she’s not wildly enthusiastic about camping in a metal shed on wheels.

And then there was the spec. My quest started three years ago with a California Ocean but I was disappointed to find that apart from the sliding door being on the offside, they didn’t have hot water and wasn’t available as a LWB. It wasn’t just that though. The staff at two VW Commercial dealerships I visited came across as disinterested incompetents with piss poor product knowledge so I started to check out the VW converter scene concluding that we would only use a VW Approved Converter. The rationale being that as well as the technical and quality merits of buying from a VW Approved Converter, the vehicle meets the legal type approval standards that allows first registration with a body type as a ‘motor caravan’ not as a ‘van with windows’, and M1 ‘passenger vehicle‘ category and not as N1 ‘commercial’ vehicle..

To cut a long story short, out of the VW Approved Converters I found only Hillside ticked all the right boxes for me, in terms of attitude, expertise, quality standards and product. Jerba came a close second but they’re located in Scotland which wasn’t particularly convenient. Rolling Homes was also a close joint second but although based nearby, couldn’t deliver the spec I wanted (no hot water).

 

[Camper_Chris]

View attachment 199381
Had a look behind the secret door earlier to have a look at the current mains charger.

Any idea what the two loose cables could be? Perhaps spare connections for optional extras I don’t have?

Incidentally whilst on the topic of this cupboard, I was quite disappointed to find out the hot water cylinder on mine is mains power only. Seen various forum posts and videos where owners of older Birchovers have been able to heat on 12V also whilst travelling to site or driving around. I guess it won’t be that big an issue though

Access to the other electrics is via the cupboard at the rear, the screws are hidden in the carpet/lining.

 

[Camper_Chris]

I agree EAN. It’s the principal reason I chose a Hillside over other converters including VW. If I was paying someone else to do the conversion, then I certainly didn’t want a horrorshow from a bunch of backstreet cowboys. I’m married to a cynical Yorkshirewoman and she could understand the value of that even though she’s not wildly enthusiastic about camping in a metal shed on wheels.

And then there was the spec. My quest started three years ago with a California Ocean but I was disappointed to find that apart from the sliding door being on the offside, they didn’t have hot water and wasn’t available as a LWB. It wasn’t just that though. The staff at two VW Commercial dealerships I visited came across as disinterested incompetents with piss poor product knowledge so I started to check out the VW converter scene concluding that we would only use a VW Approved Converter. The rationale being that as well as the technical and quality merits of buying from a VW Approved Converter, the vehicle meets the legal type approval standards that allows first registration with a body type as a ‘motor caravan’ not as a ‘van with windows’, and M1 ‘passenger vehicle‘ category and not as N1 ‘commercial’ vehicle..

To cut a long story short, out of the VW Approved Converters I found only Hillside ticked all the right boxes for me, in terms of attitude, expertise, quality standards and product. Jerba came a close second but they’re located in Scotland which wasn’t particularly convenient. Rolling Homes was also a close joint second but although based nearby, couldn’t deliver the spec I wanted (no hot water).

Lowdhams in Nottingham use Hillside to convert their Van's, the V5 documents says Hillside.

 

[sarah_86]

I agree EAN. It’s the principal reason I chose a Hillside over other converters including VW. If I was paying someone else to do the conversion, then I certainly didn’t want a horrorshow from a bunch of backstreet cowboys. I’m married to a cynical Yorkshirewoman and she could understand the value of that even though she’s not wildly enthusiastic about camping in a metal shed on wheels.

And then there was the spec. My quest started three years ago with a California Ocean but I was disappointed to find that apart from the sliding door being on the offside, they didn’t have hot water and wasn’t available as a LWB. It wasn’t just that though. The staff at two VW Commercial dealerships I visited came across as disinterested incompetents with piss poor product knowledge so I started to check out the VW converter scene concluding that we would only use a VW Approved Converter. The rationale being that as well as the technical and quality merits of buying from a VW Approved Converter, the vehicle meets the legal type approval standards that allows first registration with a body type as a ‘motor caravan’ not as a ‘van with windows’, and M1 ‘passenger vehicle‘ category and not as N1 ‘commercial’ vehicle..

To cut a long story short, out of the VW Approved Converters I found only Hillside ticked all the right boxes for me, in terms of attitude, expertise, quality standards and product. Jerba came a close second but they’re located in Scotland which wasn’t particularly convenient. Rolling Homes was also a close joint second but although based nearby, couldn’t deliver the spec I wanted (no hot water).

This pretty much echos my research.
I think there’s so many places popping up as converters these days (especially post covid) I wanted somewhere that had been doing conversions long before they became a potential money spinner for places. The warranty given is no good if the company isn’t trading anymore so a company with some years behind it was a must.
I also wanted hot water, RIB bed and the SCA roof which narrowed things down a lot.
In the end I bought a van that even unconverted would be worth £35k ish which meant that the approved conversion basically new with warranty until July 2025 (albeit it cost me £95 to transfer ) cost me £20k on top. I struggled to find anywhere doing a decent SWB conversion to the Hillside spec for £20k, many with water containers instead of underslung tanks and ply worktop rather than solid surface etc.

I know the DC DC charger is a pitfall but for me I was willing to sort that out because all other boxes were ticked. However, if as Captain Quick has said, I have a charger that’s not compatible with the installed leisure battery technology I will be taking it up as a warranty issue! Home in half an hour and first thing I’ll do is check but 99.9% sure it’s Varta AGM

 

[Captain Quick]

Lowdhams in Nottingham use Hillside to convert their Van's, the V5 documents says Hillside.

A couple of other companies sell rebadged Hillside conversions too which I think is a good recommendation for the company.

 

[sarah_86]

This pretty much echos my research.
I think there’s so many places popping up as converters these days (especially post covid) I wanted somewhere that had been doing conversions long before they became a potential money spinner for places. The warranty given is no good if the company isn’t trading anymore so a company with some years behind it was a must.
I also wanted hot water, RIB bed and the SCA roof which narrowed things down a lot.
In the end I bought a van that even unconverted would be worth £35k ish which meant that the approved conversion basically new with warranty until July 2025 (albeit it cost me £95 to transfer ) cost me £20k on top. I struggled to find anywhere doing a decent SWB conversion to the Hillside spec for £20k, many with water containers instead of underslung tanks and ply worktop rather than solid surface etc.

I know the DC DC charger is a pitfall but for me I was willing to sort that out because all other boxes were ticked. However, if as Captain Quick has said, I have a charger that’s not compatible with the installed leisure battery technology I will be taking it up as a warranty issue! Home in half an hour and first thing I’ll do is check but 99.9% sure it’s Varta AGM

 

[Captain Quick]

I know the DC DC charger is a pitfall but for me I was willing to sort that out because all other boxes were ticked. However, if as Captain Quick has said, I have a charger that’s not compatible with the installed leisure battery technology I will be taking it up as a warranty issue! Home in half an hour and first thing I’ll do is check but 99.9% sure it’s Varta AGM

I’m fairly sure that your Varta battery is a 7P0915105A which is indeed an AGM type. The warning label on the battery regarding replacing with an AGM battery seems to confirm this. It will be interesting to know what Hillside say about charging an AGM leisure battery with a charger that doesn’t appear to have a dedicated AGM charge profile. I guess it‘ll be set to the Pb-Gel setting but this seems less than ideal for an AGM battery.

 

[sarah_86]

I’m fairly sure that your Varta battery is a 7P0915105A which is indeed an AGM type. The warning label on the battery regarding replacing with an AGM battery seems to confirm this. It will be interesting to know what Hillside say about charging an AGM leisure battery with a charger that doesn’t appear to have a dedicated AGM charge profile. I guess it‘ll be set to the Pb-Gel setting but this seems less than ideal for an AGM battery.

Yes I will definitely query it (once I’ve signed the warranty transfer form )

I notice the instruction manual I have is the correct ‘-3’ version with an AGM charging capability, but can’t see that designation on the actual unit which you spotted with your eagle eye! However when I googled the ‘-3’ version, the images shown make it seem like it just says 516 on the front which I guess means it could be the correct type

 

[Captain Quick]

Yes I will definitely query it (once I’ve signed the warranty transfer form )

I notice the instruction manual I have is the correct ‘-3’ version with an AGM charging capability, but can’t see that designation on the actual unit which you spotted with your eagle eye! However when I googled the ‘-3’ version, the images shown make it seem like it just says 516 on the front which I guess means it could be the correct type

The way to tell is to see if there is a two or three position switch inside the unit (at the top next to the heat sink). The switch sets the charge profile. The 516-3 has an 3-position switch and the 516 has got a 2-position switch.

According to the 516-3 user manual the three position switch should be set in position C for an AGM charging profile. Neither version of the charger is suitable for charging a lithium battery though so when the time comes to go lithium it unfortunately means a new controller.

 

[Gàirnealair]

I saw on the CBE website that this model has now been superceded by a CB-516-3 model which has a third charge mode specifically for AGM batteries. Just out of interest, is your leisure battery an AGM type?

BTW, I can't work out the purpose of the two unconnected tails behind the panel.

That is weird - @sarah_86 has (I think) a new Birchover.

Mine is a 2021 and definitely has the CB516-3 with a setting for AGM batteries. Both the vehicle (engine) battery and the leisure battery on mine are AGM so I assumed that was what Hillside always fitted?

Sarah - I'm sorry I cannot go down to the van now to check, but my recollection is that once you have contorted yourself into a position which no physio would approve of, you are looking for a very small selector switch on the top left of the unit and one of the options was definitely AGM.

 

[Captain Quick]

Sounds as if Hillside are fitting a charger with an AGM charging profile then. Thanks Gàirnealair.

 

[Captain Quick]

@Captain Quick
Check with Hillside how they view the warranty on your SCA roof, if you were to DIY or even get another company to put holes in it. Might or might not be a problem or even an issue to them or you, but if a problem does occur, it’s usually always someone else’s fault.

I’ve now spoken to Hillside and they confirmed they can fit the SCA-approved roof rails into the recesses that run down each side of the SCA pop-top roof (192 version). These can be used to attach roof bars or, as I require, to fit a rigid 200W solar panel. The rail kit is apparently readily available and will be fitted during the build. This will allow me to fit a rigid solar panel at a later time although they offered to supply and install a rigid PV panel at the same time if I wanted them to. Another box ticked.

 

[sarah_86]

I’ve now spoken to Hillside and they confirmed they can fit the SCA-approved roof rails into the recesses that run down each side of the SCA pop-top roof (192 version). These can be used to attach roof bars or, as I require, to fit a rigid 200W solar panel. The rail kit is apparently readily available and will be fitted during the build. This will allow me to fit a rigid solar panel at a later time although they offered to supply and install a rigid PV panel at the same time if I wanted them to. Another box ticked.

Good news! I think from a general hassle and also a warranty perspective it’s definitely worth going down that route and having them fitted by Hillside.

I will do some acrobatics later and take a look at the top of my battery charger to establish the settings!

 

[sarah_86]

I’m a bit concerned to report I couldn’t find any switch for battery charging modes anywhere on the CB516 charger fitted to my van. Checked all 4 sides so, unless it’s under the cover, I don’t think it’s the -3 model which is a worry with an AGM battery!

 

[Gàirnealair]

@sarah_86 If memory serves me correctly (which it does not always do!!) you need to undo the main cover, and the switch is inside.

But given how thoroughly hidden the charger is, and how much stuff I have in the cupboard in front of it, sorry but you will have to check for yourself

 

[Captain Quick]

I’m a bit concerned to report I couldn’t find any switch for battery charging modes anywhere on the CB516 charger fitted to my van. Checked all 4 sides so, unless it’s under the cover, I don’t think it’s the -3 model which is a worry with an AGM battery!

Sarah, you’ll see the location of the ‘DIP switch’ on Page 8 of the User Manual. As Gàirnealair says, to access it you’ll need to take the cover off. This switch is referred to as ‘the Charging Line Selector’ at the top of the unit (with the cover removed). If it’s the CB516-3 model it should have three positions A, B and C, otherwise it’ll have just two positions marked A and B if it’s the earlier CB516 model. To be honest it looks like it’s going to be a challenge to access it. Hope that helps.